On Sep 27, 10:37 am, candy_won...@hotmail.com wrote:

There are basically three kinds of 'commercial' photography:

1) Studio product
2) Studio models
3) Location (architecture, business portrait, event, etc.)

Generally NO-ONE starts out as a commercial photographer without
having worked with a studio or location pro as an assistant. I have
worked with several commercial pros.

Much work of that type is through advertising agencies; specifically,
through the art director (AKA "Devil-Man"  :).  In some cases, the
business is large enough to have an in house department for
advertising.  In either case, it is helpful to have a wide (and good)
acquaintanceship with art directors...everything else being equal,
people do business with their friends.  Doesn't hurt to hang out where
they hang out.  Join clubs they join.

One way to start is to build a decent portfolio and arrange
appointments with ADs to show them your work.  The portfolio should
have various types of work but heavy on the type handled by the
particular agency.  For example, if a particular agency is handling a
large department store and you walk in with a portfolio of
architectural photos it will be ho-hum time.  Conversely, if that AD
is constantly spitting out color supplements selling clothes with
models on location, he will be more attentive if your portfolio
contains that type of work.

He will be even more attentive if you can discuss with him some of his
recent work.  Preferably in intelligently flattering terms; for
example..."I really liked that slick (slick: high grade, filled paper
allowing greater reproduction resolution) newspaper insert you did
recently for Big Department Store...the one featuring transitional
fashions suitable for both summer and fall.  I particularly liked the
melding of summer and fall colors in the typography. "  (You can often
tell who does what by reading the credits in ads/brochures).  Do your
homework and don't try to peddle apples to a butcher.

Keep in mind that an AD is concerned with the *total* project -
typography, theme, layout, etc. - not just photography.  The easier
you can make his life...the more you can help him overcome
problems...the higher his estimation will be of you.  You need to be
knowledgeable about the entire process too.  If he starts talking
about needing 4x5 transparencies for the separations you better know
what he is talking about.  And why.

Also keep in mind that an interview like this is basically a job
application.  You are selling you.  You should be appropriately
dressed, attentive, polite...you need to come across as a "can-do"
person - one who will deliver what is needed on time every time
without exception!  Never *EVER* take a job you think you might have
difficulty fulfilling.  You should thank the AD for his time (I say
"his" but there are many women ADs).  Tell him you'd really like to
work with him.  Ask if he has anything coming up that he might
consider you for.  Wouldn't ask for comments on your work either.
Follow up (both in person and by phone) periodically.
_______________

Pretty rare if - by client - you mean a non-agency person.  Heck, I
was a photographer and *I* used an agency for my own advertising.  Did
my own photos though  :)

Of course, there is lots of commercial photography that doesn't
necessarily come via agencies; architectural is one; construction
progress photos is another.

Regardless of who lets the work, it is extremely unlikely that they
will be seeking you out unless and until you develop either a "name"
or a unique style for some specific type of photography.  One
potential problem with the latter is the possibility of being typed
*solely* for that type of photography and, consequently, not being
considered for other jobs.
___________________

Uhhh...unless you are talking to a complete doofus, they will be
telling you what is needed.  They might even give you a piece of scrap
(rough drawing) and say, "Do this".
___________________

You need to establish in your own mind how much you want per hour,
half day and day.  Initially, that will be difficult for you because
you simply don't know going rates.  In establishing them, you have to
figure in any and all overhead,  profit PLUS the probability that only
a small amount of your time will actually be spent shooting.  Variable
expenses such as lab work are often billed separately adding a
reasonable markup.  Once you have determined your rates, you can use
them to determine a price for about anything as you gain experience.

You wouldn't necessarily be talking about your rates to customers,
though; ADs and others in the biz, yes; others, no.  For example, if a
good buddy just built his dream McMansion and tells you he'd like to
have a nice big framed photo of same figure out how much time it would
take you, add in the marked up lab work and you have a price.  If his
jaw drops when you quote it, tell him you can toss in a couple of
8x10s too.  :)  If his jaw didn't drop, your rate may be too low.

With ADs and their ilk, you'll find that jobs generally have a budget.
That budget is generally for the entire job, not just photography.
Nevertheless, some portion has generally been tentatively assigned to
photography and it doesn't hurt to ask what that budget is.  If it is
=> what you want you are home free; if it is less there is nothing
wrong with asking if it is written in stone.  If it is, there is
nothing wrong with taking a job for less than you normally get
*HOWEVER* I think it is reasonable to let the AD know that fact and
that you are doing it as a favor expecting he will also throw higher
paying goodies your way when possible.

I don't ever recall having a contract for any of the relatively small
amount of agency work I did.  You send them an invoice and they pay
it.  Usually a few months later  :(  With retail type people (like the
McMansion guy) I'd just make up a work order for their signature
detailing what they were to get and how much it cost.  If the guy was
flaky or shaky I'd get all or most up front.

With agencies/businesses, another concern is "rights"...where the work
will be used, how frequently and for how long.  That's a whole nuther
thing and I won't get into it except to say that anything other than
"local, one time" generally calls for more money.
__________________

Good idea  :)
__________________

Hard to edit contact sheets.  Transparencies, only (IMO) if they are
technically bad.  Digital, I don't know, retired before it became much
used.  I prefered showing anything useable to the customer...his
tastes don't necessarily coincide with mine.

__________________

Yeah, they'll want to see it.
___________________

If you didn't get it right the first time it is unlikely you'll be
given a second opportunity.  No etc. either.  Ever.