Photo Forum / Photo Technique / People Photography / April 2005
wedding pictures
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sarah amaton - 09 Apr 2005 10:25 GMT hello,
My friend is getting married in a couple of weeks and she can't afford a photographer, so I want to take some pictures of just the bride and groom and maybe the brial party.Now I know this could be all wrong since the wedding is so special and my pictures might not be all that,but she knows I'm not professional and she is not paying me it's just something I would like to do for her. Anyways,getting the point. I have an olympus slr om-1 with a 49mm skylight(1b) filter.My friend's wedding is at a golf course and the pictures will be outdoor and partly shaded.I would also like to take some pictures that look soft and alittle fuzzy. Does anyone have any suggestions on what kind of film and filters to use.
Thanks lots, sarah
Gregory Blank - 10 Apr 2005 01:55 GMT > hello, > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > Thanks lots, > sarah Oh boy here we go again.
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Scott Coutts - 10 Apr 2005 02:44 GMT >>hello, >> [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > Oh boy here we go again. How useful you have been. Good thing for all of us that you're here to relay such insight.
Anyway...
Firstly, I'm certainly no expert, but this is what I'd do. Bear in mind that it might be wrong (: Someone else heremight be able to help. Post also in some other groups like rec.photo and aus.photo etc if you want some more info.
Given that you're shooting someone's wedding, then if you're not sure about something, then I'd recommend sticking with the basics. At least, stick with what you're very comfortable with. This is espeically important if you're shooting on film where you can't check to see that you've gotten the shots that you want. A wedding isnt the place for testing out new methods and experimenting (: If you really want something different, then shoot lots and lots and lots of film, bracket your exposures etc. Shoot as many as you can, so even if you have to throw 80% in the bin, you'll still get some good ones. I'm not saying you're a bad photographer, I'm just saying the more you shoot the greater your chances of success and getting a 'special' shot rather than a snap shot. You'll only get one chance. You dont have to print them all... get the lab to do negs only, or negs and a proof sheet. Then look through the negs and proof sheets to find the ones you want and get only those done.
Shoot lots of 'normal' ones and some experimental ones. Also, consider shooting some black and white (real black and white, not C41) . They can turn out nice, but again, do lots of bracketing, especially if you're dealing with traditional dark shadows (suits) and bright whites (dresses) in the same frame.
If you want 'soft' shots, you can get filters from Hoya and others that will do it for you. They're called Hoya Softener A and Softener B. THere's also a diffuser (it's called that) and also a filter that will soften only the edges, and leave a sharp centre (Hoya Centre Spot).
Also, there are special films for shooting portraits that you might like to consider, such as the Fuji NPS160. There's also high contrast portrait film called NPC160 which can give nice high-contrast shots with bright colours.
Do you have a flash that you know how to use well? If so, use some fill flash if they're in the shadows. Otherwise, move them somewhere that you can get good light (but not full blazing sun)
If you have, or can borrow, an extra camera, then that's even better, because you can have black and white and normal film, or normal film and portrait film going at once, and you can shoot with one camera and then the other. Otherwise, use up an entire roll in one go, and then shoot with another roll straight after.
Lastly, do lots of reading on the net on wedding techiniques. There'll be lots of good tips and tricks to use, and ways to make sure you get good shots.
Most of all, good luck. I hope you get some nice shots (:
Scott.
Al Denelsbeck - 10 Apr 2005 09:59 GMT > hello, > [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > Thanks lots, > sarah Scott's advice is pretty solid, but I'll add a little to it as well.
Definitely some portrait film, Fuji NPH or Kodak Portra 400 is where I'd aim. Excellent skin tones and pleasant contrast levels.
Buy, beg, borrow, or scrounge a couple of extra lenses if possible, 35mm and 85mm, or as close as you can get. 35mm will give you a wider view to do "locale" shots or small groups, 85mm or a little longer will be better for portraits. Even 50mm, when used close to people, can distort faces in an unflattering way. Standing back further and using a short telephoto works a lot better. Also, it gives better control over depth-of- field, letting the background go much softer while keeping your subject sharp.
Avoid mixed lighting. Contrast always increases on film, even low- contrast film, and those soft shadows can become much darker in the prints. Try to stay in the same lighting, and for preference, open shade. Using a flash, even when the light seems sufficient, can help balance the light levels, but since you may not have time to get familiar with this, shoot with and without flash.
Multiple shots of everything. It's that really great shot that someone will have their eyes closed in ;-)
Couple of key things for weddings. Remember that the classic print size is 8x10, yet your film frame is a different ratio (8x12). Leave space on the sides when framing your photos to account for this cropping - in other words, think closer in terms of a square rather than using the entire frame.
Also, be sure to shoot quite a few full-length poses, including feet. Get details of the dress, preferably from all sides, and as Scott says, bracket (shoot exposures a little above and below the exposure that the camera meter provides). White dresses and black tuxes often fool the camera meter, which is adjusted for middle grey.
Watch every little detail. Your eye should rove the entire background visible in the frame, as well as every detail on the happy couple, for each shot. It's real easy to get that annoying distraction in there that can ruin a photo. Especially watch errant clothing, placement of hands, wilting flowers, and so on. Photo assistants are fabulous for this - two people knowing what to look for is always better, and one can rush forward and smooth the dress train while you hold position.
Soft focus. A screw-on filter would probably annoy you, since your best bet is to shoot the same images with and without - they behave differently in different lighting, and have the most dreamy effect with *soft* backlighting. If you buy one, go instead for the square format slide-in filters intended with filter holders like Cokin, and simply hold it up in front of the lens when needed. In a pinch, you can also use a clean piece of old nylon hose stretched over the lens, a clear filter with petroleum jelly smeared around the outer edges, and if weather conditions permit, a hard huff of breath can condense onto the lens or filter long enough to work well, but you gotta move quick.
Best bet: If you can arrange a test shoot ahead of time in the same locale and conditions, you will learn a tremendous amount. Take notes if necessary, but the couple of rolls you use will be wisely spent.
Plan on failures. If you can't have a backup body, at least have loads of batteries, and a small tool kit. Lots of film. Straight and safety pins. Lots of lens cleaning materials. Don't let yourself get flustered - this leads to stupid errors you'll hate yourself for. Take breathers and think back over what you're doing, and watch the camera settings carefully. It's easy to forget you set aperture for high depth-of-field and are now in a situation where the shutter speed is too slow to handhold for sharp photos.
All that said, relax and be upbeat and even a little goofy. At least half of the photographer's job is handling the subjects, and your emotions will be catching, so make them work for you. The 'happy' couple will probably be stressed out of their minds, so take control from them and do it like you've been doing it all your life - they'll be happy to let you handle it and much more relaxed. Have fun with it, and shoot a couple frames just for giggles. Take the opportunity to do a couple of informals and photojournalistic shots before and after, too.
Hope this helps, and best of luck to you all.
- Al.
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Whatevah - 12 Apr 2005 05:01 GMT > hello, > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > Thanks lots, > sarah Try to find a photography student willing to do it for cheap or for a portfolio. Even if they haven't shot weddings before, they should have a solid portfolio showing that they can shoot well, and artistically. If you live in a metropolitan area, craigslist.org is a good place to start looking.
It may result in better pictures than you could do, and also allow you to enjoy the wedding.
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zeitgeist - 12 Apr 2005 07:33 GMT > My friend is getting married in a couple of weeks and she can't afford a > photographer, so I want to take some pictures of just the bride and groom [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > pictures that look soft and alittle fuzzy. Does anyone have any suggestions > on what kind of film and filters to use. The first thing you want to do get the subjects in the shade, direct sun is the definition of harsh lighting and far too contrasty for film to handle, that means washed out noses and eyes that disappear in the shadow of the eyebrow. You could fill flash but would need a strong powerful flash for the groups. You would need f/11 for fill light with the sun as the main or key light at f/16 using an ISO of 125 (shooting 160 film is close enough) so your proper exposure will be similar to your flash sync speed. Any built in flash will not cut it, a good shoe flash may give enough but most are made for 5-10 feet. In open shade the lighting will be softer, much less contrasty, if you have light coming straight down (like at mid day) then the eyes may still be lost in shadow but since open shade is 4 stops less than bright sun your shoe flash will have a better chance of doing its job.
and now for a gratuitous snarky comment, this is a public forum on the internet afterall, but as for the soft and a little fuzzy, isn't that a little redundant with that camera? hehehe, sorry, couldn't resist.
you know it amazes me, but of all the concerns a photographer would have shooting a wedding for the first time, of all the questions to ask, its always 'what film?" My question to you is, what kind of paper does your lab run? Film is film unless you really know exposures, have done tests to determine your working ISO, and you can start to notice differences. If you don't know what your camera is doing, IE: the dial 'says' 1/125th but what is the actual speed? then which brand of film is nearly irrelevant.
here's my best tip for you and your 'client,' take them out for an engagement portrait, this will do two things, give each of you a clue as to what to expect, they will see what you can do and most importantly, they will know what you need from them. This one thing will help you out far more than any other tip trick or technique you do on the wedding day. I mean, they will probably have a rehearsal for the ceremony, like how difficult is it to figure out how to walk down the aisle? do an rehearsal for the pictures.
Marc 182 - 12 Apr 2005 09:10 GMT > > My friend is getting married in a couple of weeks and she can't afford a > > photographer, so I want to take some pictures of just the bride and groom [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > that means washed out noses and eyes that disappear in the shadow of the > eyebrow. <snip the good advice>
Where's Randalsaurus and his manditory 4x5 box cameras for weddings?
Marc
Randall Ainsworth - 12 Apr 2005 13:48 GMT > Where's Randalsaurus and his manditory 4x5 box cameras for weddings? I'm still here, just mostly a lurker these days.
If you dinks want to take on wedding photography, be my guest. Through the years I've seen enough amateur weddings to make anybody puke. What do I care? Dust off that 35mm, stick the flash on top, and have at it.
Marc 182 - 13 Apr 2005 05:45 GMT > > Where's Randalsaurus and his manditory 4x5 box cameras for weddings? > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > the years I've seen enough amateur weddings to make anybody puke. What > do I care? Dust off that 35mm, stick the flash on top, and have at it. And just as yankable as ever.
Udie Lafing - 13 Apr 2005 10:23 GMT > > > Where's Randalsaurus and his manditory 4x5 box cameras for weddings? > > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > And just as yankable as ever. And everyone knows your one of the best yanker's there is.
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Joshua Putnam - 12 Apr 2005 09:23 GMT > > Anyways,getting the point. I have an olympus slr om-1
> and now for a gratuitous snarky comment, this is a public forum on the > internet afterall, but as for the soft and a little fuzzy, isn't that a > little redundant with that camera? hehehe, sorry, couldn't resist. I suppose that would depend on the lens -- sure, it's not medium format, but the OM-1 isn't a favorite of astrophotographers because it's soft and fuzzy. In competent hands, it's better than most autofocus wonderbricks.
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Craig Flory - 12 Apr 2005 13:22 GMT I'd like to add my two cents. I've been a profesional photographer since 1966. I have heard of many friends who became ex-friends by trying to create images of someones wedding. Portraits can be re-done but weddings must be captured well the 1st time. You would be a much better friend by hiring a pro for one hour of formals. But, if you must do the photos, I'd suggest that you do the photos in NOT shade but open shade. There is a big difference. Scout out the location several weeks before. Ask someone to pose for you. Use a fast film ... you do not want to open up the aperature. You want to use a small aperature for a good depth of field.After the film is developed look carefully at them to see how you did. I hope you own Adobe Photoshop. If so ... have digital scans done too. That way you will be able to make corrections. As for exposure ... you want to work in open shade so there will be some detail in the people. Use an external powerful flash on a light stand and a long flash cord. Use a hand held light meter. Meter for the faces and also for the background. Use an exposure for the background and use enough flash power to light the faces while the exposure allows the background to have separation from the people. If you can't do all this I once again urge you to not do this. Hire someone as your special gift.
Craig Flory
Helios35966@ayhoo.com - 14 Apr 2005 23:29 GMT Easiest way to make a soft focus filter is to take a skylight or UV filter (I buy ones with dented front rings for this-never paid over $2 for one) and spray they with hairspray. If you don't get the effect you want-ie too soft or not soft enough,just soak it in rubbing alcohol for about 2 minutes and the hairspray washes off and you can try again. As to film,oddly enough,my best results have been on Fuji's 200 speed Superia film...seems there's a UV absorbing layer that pretty much stops the problem of wedding dresses turning a very pale shade of blue. On lenses.....buy,beg,borrow or steal a 28-80 or something in that range. That one lens will do 90% of the pictures you'll do at a wedding. If you can find one,the Tamron 28-80 SP is a great lens for wedding work.
> hello, > [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > Thanks lots, > sarah zeitgeist - 19 Apr 2005 06:07 GMT > Easiest way to make a soft focus filter is to take a skylight or UV filter > (I buy ones with dented front rings for this-never paid over $2 for one) and > spray they with hairspray. If you don't get the effect you want-ie too soft > or not soft enough,just soak it in rubbing alcohol for about 2 minutes and > the hairspray washes off and you can try again. as one who went through the whole "buy top quality tack sharp lenses for my medium format gear only to do many things to soften it" routine, hair spray is one of those things that mushes up the focus which is not the same thing as softening it.
GOOD soft focus retains a sharp image. Good soft focus looks better as you enlarge it. Mushy focus looks ok rather small but falls apart when enlarged.
The best cheap soft focus is two layers of cheap nylon netting, (not expensive hosiery, the good stuff adds to much warmth to the image.) Black netting will absorb some light rays on a seemingly random pattern (if tight enough and that's why you want to use two layers at least) and diffract light passing close to the edges of each thread, that's what makes the image partly soft. White netting works similarly but seems to do more with the highlights and lowers contrast more.
one trick I heard about but never tried was to take a cheap UV filter and apply tiny dots of clear glue in a random pattern.
I eventually used Harrison Black dots (Which actually looked like someone spit chewing tobacco between two sheets of glass) and then invested in a real soft focus lens which I consider one of my better investments in image gadgetry.
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Craig Flory - 22 Apr 2005 02:02 GMT One thing I'd like to add. I no longer ever add soft focus over the lens anymore. Once you add it you can never remove it. So I create images as sharp as possible. Then I add soft focus in Adobe Photoshop I can control how much and where it falls.I also never do double exposures anymore in the camera. I do it in Photoshop by combining images with a layer mask. As a professional photographer I want total control and I didn't get that doing soft focus and double exposures in camera.
Craig Flory
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