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Photo Forum / Film Photography / Medium format / May 2004the *real* Ultron lens ?
I am trying to find information on the old Voigtlander (i.e not Cosina) Ultron lens such as its construction and number of elements. Can somebody suggest a URL? When I do a search I always end up with the new Cosina-Voigtlander Leica mount lenses. > I am trying to find information on the old Voigtlander (i.e not > Cosina) Ultron lens such as its construction and number of elements. > Can somebody suggest a URL? When I do a search I always end up with > the new Cosina-Voigtlander Leica mount lenses. You might want to search for "Color Ultron". That's what its called on my VSL1. Ralf  SignatureRalf R. Radermacher - DL9KCG - Köln/Cologne, Germany private homepage: http://www.fotoralf.de manual cameras and photo galleries - updated April 29, 2004 Contarex - Kiev 60 - Horizon 202 - P6 mount lenses from Dr. Mabuse's posting at my lens type pages http://medfmt.8k.com/mf/lenstype.html: Not to confuse with the "-gons" which name wide-angle lens designs. the only special developments I know were the Voigtlaender Septon and Nokton with 7 elements in 5 groups and a very peculiar Zeiss/Voigtlaender design for the Icarex called Ultron 50mm/1.8 with 6 elements in 5 groups. This one has a concave front element what is absolutely unusual ! I'm looking for this in TM version but they are very seldom. To induce even more confusion Zeiss/Voigtlaender marketed later on a "Color-Ultron" for the SL-706 and VSL-1 with the same specifications but with a Planar design of 6/4. The Planar design mayo be easier to correct for close-up region. end-quote hth - bobm Signature*********************************************************************** * Robert Monaghan POB 752182 Southern Methodist Univ. Dallas Tx 75275 * ********************Standard Disclaimers Apply************************* > from Dr. Mabuse's posting at my lens type pages > http://medfmt.8k.com/mf/lenstype.html: [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > elements in 5 groups. This one has a concave front element what is > absolutely unusual ! I seem to recall a Pentax lens design with a concave front element - wonder if there is any similarity. > I'm looking for this in TM version but they are very seldom. > To induce even more confusion Zeiss/Voigtlaender marketed later on a [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > hth - bobm Peter > > from Dr. Mabuse's posting at my lens type pages > > http://medfmt.8k.com/mf/lenstype.html: [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > I seem to recall a Pentax lens design with a concave front element - wonder > if there is any similarity. When my brother bought his first 35mm SLR, he didn't know much about brands. There was one camera made of good components, whose normal lens was very good on paper. The salesman even mentioned that it had been designed with a computer (this was late sixties), and the computer had said to use a concave first element. BTW, the maker was called Cosina... -- Lassi Lassi Hippeläinen <lahippel@ieee.orgies.invalid> wrote in message news:<40B0F116.5146EFC2@ieee.orgies.invalid>... > > > from Dr. Mabuse's posting at my lens type pages > > > http://medfmt.8k.com/mf/lenstype.html: [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > -- Lassi I seem to recall that when Voigtlander (I mean *real* Voigtlander and not Cosina) 35mm format cameras were offered on sale with alternative lenses then the Ultron lens version was only very slightly more expensive than the Color-Skopar version. This makes me think that at that time they may have been very similar designs. If the Ultron lens were more than a 4 element design at that time then surely it would have sold for a lot more. Like comparing the Color Heliar with the Color Skopar for their Bessa II models, the Color Heliar version being sold for a lot more having the extra element. > Lassi Hippeläinen <lahippel@ieee.orgies.invalid> wrote in message news:<40B0F116.5146EFC2@ieee.orgies.invalid>... > > > [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > Color Skopar for their Bessa II models, the Color Heliar version being > sold for a lot more having the extra element. Also the Ultron was the f2.0 and the Color-Skopar was an f2.8 with the Ultron version being only slightly more expensive. If the Ultron was a six element lens and the Color-Skopar a 4 element lens, then I would have thoght the price difference would be very significant. Certainly, on the Vitessa L , it has a convex front and not a concave front as I have heard other Ultrons had. I just wonder if it is another Color-Skopar with a wider aperture with the Ultron name used to distinguish the two models. >> Lassi Hippeläinen <lahippel@ieee.orgies.invalid> wrote in message >> news:<40B0F116.5146EFC2@ieee.orgies.invalid>... [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] > six element lens and the Color-Skopar a 4 element lens, then I would > have thoght the price difference would be very significant. A heliar is a difficult lens to make, hence it's extra cost. There were never any f2.0 tessar style lenses that I know of, so the ultron would have been at least a 5 if not 6 element lens, probably a planar type. There is more to dificulty/expence in design than the number of lens elements. SignatureStacey > >> Lassi Hippeläinen <lahippel@ieee.orgies.invalid> wrote in message > >> news:<40B0F116.5146EFC2@ieee.orgies.invalid>... [quoted text clipped - 40 lines] > never any f2.0 tessar style lenses that I know of, so the ultron would have > been at least a 5 if not 6 element lens, probably a planar type. A good point -- I have never heard of an example of a f2.0 Tessar type either. > There is more to dificulty/expence in design than the number of lens > elements. The original camera price for the Vitessa L I saw had the Ultron version only $20 more than the Color-Skopar version. If the Ultron was easy to make, hence the low cost, then I have to wonder why people even bothered with the Tessar design because thy could have a better corrected lens with a wider aperture at roughly the same cost. To be fair, I have not seen a copy of the original advertisement for the Vitessa L and so I am trusting sombody's compilation of original prices. Does anyone have a copy of an advertisement for a Vitessa L in any language so they can post the advertised prices for the different versions? > The original camera price for the Vitessa L I saw had the Ultron > version only $20 more than the Color-Skopar version. If the Ultron was > easy to make, hence the low cost, then I have to wonder why people > even bothered with the Tessar design because thy could have a better > corrected lens with a wider aperture at roughly the same cost. $20 was a pretty good bit of money back then. Also many casual users would never see the difference. Just look at how many novar lensed ikontas there are, people won't spend money for stuff like this. SignatureStacey If I remember correctly, Ultron 50/2 is a planar like 6 element design lens but it was only used on RF camera in the past (ie Vitessa, Vito III & Prominent). Whereas Septon 50/2 was the premium standard lens used on Voigtlander's SLR Bessamatic series (7 element correct me if I am wrong). When Icarex was introduced, Ultron design was selected as the premium standard lens. In order to resolve the lens to film distance from the reflex mirror, a concave element was added. Hence, there was Icarex Ultron 50/1.8 with concave front element. Subsequently, Color Ultron 50/1.8 on Voigtlander VSL series was essentially a relabelled Planar 50/1.8. The 50/2 Ultron lens is a 6-lens design. I assume you mean the Ultron lens way back? 195X and 196X ....e.g. the lens used on Vitomatics? A nice link to start with it this: .....click on cameras .... http://www.classic-cameras.info/camindexe.html There are several links also.....you can mail and ask questions ect. Max > I am trying to find information on the old Voigtlander (i.e not > Cosina) Ultron lens such as its construction and number of elements. > Can somebody suggest a URL? When I do a search I always end up with > the new Cosina-Voigtlander Leica mount lenses. |
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