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Photo Forum / Film Photography / Medium format / February 2005Choosing between Kiev 60 and Kiev 88
A friend of mine inherited two Kiev cameras, and she is thinking about selling them. One is a 60 and the other is an 88. The 60 has a small label on the front with "Kiev USA" on it. Both cameras come with their original boxes and both seem to have had very little use. I think they were purchased new in 1994. Everything I've read online suggests the model 60 is a bit more reliable than the 88. Is this correct? What should I offer for these cameras, assuming they are in good working order? The prices on eBay and used equipment sites is all over the map- I've seen asking prices high as $400 and low as $120.00 for various makes of medium format Kiev. > Everything I've read online suggests the model 60 is a bit more reliable > than the 88. Is this correct? Yes. > What should I offer for these cameras, > assuming they are in good working order? With the 88, there's no such thing as good working order. They only ever survive the next frame by the skin of their badly machined teeth. The 60 is far less capricious and since yours comes from Kiev USA one might expect a somewhat higher degree of reliability. Still, I suggest you offer as much as you think won't hurt you too badly if it breaks down within the next few rolls of film. I'm not suggesting it will but it may. Ralf  SignatureRalf R. Radermacher - DL9KCG - Köln/Cologne, Germany private homepage: http://www.fotoralf.de manual cameras and photo galleries - updated Jan. 10, 2005 Contarex - Kiev 60 - Horizon 202 - P6 mount lenses >A friend of mine inherited two Kiev cameras, and she is thinking about > selling them. One is a 60 and the other is an 88. The 60 has a small label [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > equipment sites is all over the map- I've seen asking prices high as $400 > and low as $120.00 for various makes of medium format Kiev. I couldn't have said it better myself, Dean. ;-) SignatureRegards, Matt Clara www.mattclara.com >I couldn't have said it better myself, Dean. >;-) Succinct, wasn't he ! > >I couldn't have said it better myself, Dean. > >;-) > > Succinct, wasn't he ! I don't know. Looks like he ran out of steam after repeating every bit of what "humanoid" said. I wouldn't call that a sign of brevity. >A friend of mine inherited two Kiev cameras, and she is thinking about >selling them. One is a 60 and the other is an 88. The 60 has a small label [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >equipment sites is all over the map- I've seen asking prices high as $400 >and low as $120.00 for various makes of medium format Kiev. Kiev USA is in NYC and has a website. Look at what they are asking new and then decide on a %, say 1/3rd or half. THOM > A friend of mine inherited two Kiev cameras, and she is thinking about > selling them. One is a 60 and the other is an 88. The 60 has a small label > on the front with "Kiev USA" on it. > Everything I've read online suggests the model 60 is a bit more reliable > than the 88. Is this correct? Not a bit, a BUNCH. Get rid of the 88 while it still works!!! A "Kiev USA" K60 is probably a good camera. > What should I offer for these cameras, > assuming they are in good working order? I wouldn't offer ANYTHING for the 88. SignatureStacey > [...] Get rid of the 88 while it still works!!! [...] > > I wouldn't offer ANYTHING for the 88. That would imply the only ethical way of "getting rid" of the "88" would be to toss it in the bin. Or is this a suggestion to sell it on to someone not as knowledgeable about these "88"s? Find a "sucker"? Hmmm... what's the word?... Fie! You can best throw it away that after it stopped working. Not before. >> [...] Get rid of the 88 while it still works!!! [...] >> >> I wouldn't offer ANYTHING for the 88. > > That would imply the only ethical way of "getting rid" of the "88" would > be to toss it in the bin. Why? People buy french cars and I'd advise the same thing. > Or is this a suggestion to sell it on to someone not as knowledgeable > about these "88"s? Find a "sucker"? Yes, now you got the idea.. SignatureStacey > Yes, now you got the idea.. These things appear to bring out the best in people. Cheapness... Envy... Fraud... > These things appear to bring out the best in people. > Cheapness... > Envy... > Fraud... Honourable but unfortunately a little off the mark... The funny thing about selling and buying second-hand Kiev 88 cameras is that the vast majority of people buying them have been given ample warning beforehand. Still, they are desperate to buy them. The long threads in various newsgroups are there for all to look them up. There are many websites for those who care to read. Mine is one of them. By your logic, thousands of items would have to be banned from ever being sold on. Stacey cited the example of French cars. I've been looking at second-hand offers for a Renault Laguna Automatic. Well over half of the Laguna's offered on various Internet sites (mobile.de etc.) seem to have transmission troubles. What about the other half? Should people be forced to scrap them? What about lottery tickets? ;-) Ralf SignatureRalf R. Radermacher - DL9KCG - Köln/Cologne, Germany private homepage: http://www.fotoralf.de manual cameras and photo galleries - updated Jan. 10, 2005 Contarex - Kiev 60 - Horizon 202 - P6 mount lenses > Honourable but unfortunately a little off the mark... Well... How many 88 are sold advertised using the seller's honest opinion that he "wouldn't offer ANYTHING for the 88"? ;-) >> Yes, now you got the idea.. > > These things appear to bring out the best in people. > Cheapness... > Envy... > Fraud.. So owning a blad turns someone into a total jerk? SignatureStacey > So owning a blad turns someone into a total jerk? If a jerk is someone who doesn't advocate selling on junk to unwitting victims, "suckers", yes. What, would you say, is the 'technical term' for someone who does? >> So owning a blad turns someone into a total jerk? > > If a jerk is someone who doesn't advocate selling on junk to unwitting > victims, "suckers", yes. I never said "sell a broken camera as a working one" etc as you are implying. If someone is too lazy to do even the tinyest bit of research to see what they are getting into, whose fault is that? I KNEW the kievs were unreliable yet I still bought one. Should I blame the person who sold it to me? You =are= acting like a jerk here so again, does owning a blad turn people into jerks? Or were you one before you bought it? SignatureStacey >>>[...] Get rid of the 88 while it still works!!! [...] >>> [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Yes, now you got the idea.. Does this advice also apply to the 88CM ? Simon. >>>>[...] Get rid of the 88 while it still works!!! [...] >>>> [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > Does this advice also apply to the 88CM ? Yep. Same camera, just a different lens mount. The main problem is the crappy kiev film backs. They jam/bind which kills the camera when you "force" it to try to wind. Also the cloth curtains used on the CM are a BAD idea, causes shutter banding. I had an 88 (actually was called a 1006M) which used 'blad backs (made by Hartblei, NOT the current ones being sold as such) and it worked fine. Unfortunatly those are HARD to find. SignatureStacey |
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