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Photo Forum / Digital Photography / Digital Photo / January 2008

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Any UK photobook publisher that will allow freeform page layout so I     can have panoramics too?

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digitaltoast - 22 Jan 2008 19:22 GMT
I came back from holiday with some great pics, and a LOT of 3 pic
panoramics from my Kodak Z712IS.
I thought a photobook would be a great idea, so I looked at Snapfish,
Kodak, Boots, Trurpint, Tescophoto, Myphotobook, and the cheapest,
Asda. Even tried iPhoto08 on a friend's Mac.
5 hours later, and each one seems to have the same problem - it wants
to crop my panoramics - I had this idea that I could maybe have a
panoramic along the top or bottom, and thee portraits below/above
that, or maybe a "throw" of photos. Plus I have a couple of "tall"
pictures, which would look great down one side. But alas, no.
I also looked into the upload options from Picasa - Bonusprint,
Photobox, Klick, Extrafilm, Foto.com, mypix, snapfish and pixu. I only
got as far as Bonusprint and Mypix from the list when I thought that
surely someone else has wanted to include Panoramics in a photobook?!
Or is the only way to print them myself, and stick them in a normal
album? If so, there's a gap in the market here!

Thanks in advance for any suggestions.
John Navas - 22 Jan 2008 19:38 GMT
>I came back from holiday with some great pics, and a LOT of 3 pic
>panoramics from my Kodak Z712IS.
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
>
>Thanks in advance for any suggestions.

The simple solution is to compose the image just the way you want it so
that no cropping is necessary before submitting the image for printing.
I routinely do that with standard images even with standard print sizes.

Signature

Best regards,
John Navas
Panasonic DMC-FZ8 (and several others)

digitaltoast - 22 Jan 2008 20:01 GMT
> The simple solution is to compose the image just the way you want it so
> that no cropping is necessary before submitting the image for printing.
> I routinely do that with standard images even with standard print sizes.

But, er...doesn't that turn a panoramic into a non-panoramic,
defeating the whole object?!
John Navas - 22 Jan 2008 20:30 GMT
>> The simple solution is to compose the image just the way you want it so
>> that no cropping is necessary before submitting the image for printing.
>> I routinely do that with standard images even with standard print sizes.
>
>But, er...doesn't that turn a panoramic into a non-panoramic,
>defeating the whole object?!

No.  At most it wastes paper, but it can be possible to use the excess
paper productively by adding other smaller images.  Case in point:
<http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=296c3fo&s=3>
8x12 paper: 4x12 panorama plus two 4x6 images.

Signature

Best regards,
John Navas
Panasonic DMC-FZ8 (and several others)

-hh - 23 Jan 2008 00:59 GMT
> > The simple solution is to compose the image just the way you want it so
> > that no cropping is necessary before submitting the image for printing.
> > I routinely do that with standard images even with standard print sizes.
>
> But, er...doesn't that turn a panoramic into a non-panoramic,
> defeating the whole object?!

For your application, yes.

John's suggestion was merely to merge photos to create a 'standard'
size to prevent wasting paper when *printing* a hardcopy.   Since you
weren't asking anything about printing, it has no relevance to the
question you asked.

-hh
John Navas - 23 Jan 2008 01:11 GMT
>> > The simple solution is to compose the image just the way you want it so
>> > that no cropping is necessary before submitting the image for printing.
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
>weren't asking anything about printing, it has no relevance to the
>question you asked.

"Or is the only way to print them myself"

Apology accepted.

Signature

Best regards,
John Navas
Panasonic DMC-FZ8 (and several others)

-hh - 23 Jan 2008 02:38 GMT
> "Or is the only way to print them myself"

Only as an utterly absolute last resort, twit.

-hh
John Navas - 23 Jan 2008 02:44 GMT
>> "Or is the only way to print them myself"
>
>Only as an utterly absolute last resort, twit.

I'm pleased to inform you that you're earned a coveted place in my twit
filter.  It's a difficult honor -- all posts have to be pretty much
devoid of any real content -- but you passed easily.

Signature

Best regards,
John Navas
Panasonic DMC-FZ8 (and several others)

-hh - 23 Jan 2008 10:11 GMT
> >> "Or is the only way to print them myself"
>
> >Only as an utterly absolute last resort, twit.
>
> I'm pleased to inform you that you're earned a coveted place in
> my twit filter.  

It is about time!

Now when it is appropriate to correct yet another one of John's
irrelevant "recommendations", the world doesn't have to then tolerate
Mr. Navas's lame attempts to deny that he screwed up so as to try to
save face.

-hh
-hh - 22 Jan 2008 20:23 GMT
> I came back from holiday with some great pics, and a LOT of 3 pic
> panoramics from my Kodak Z712IS.
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> ...
> Thanks in advance for any suggestions.

Within iPhoto (and probably most of the others), there's the option to
completely fill an entire page with one image.  You can use this
option to "cheat":

Step 1: In the template software, look at how the template software
creates its background, including white edged frames, shadows from
lifted corners, etc.  Your plan is to copy this stuff, so do some
screen captures, take a flatbed scan of a page from a previously
printed book, etc.

Step 2:  Go into Photoshop (or equivalent) and create a (large) blank
canvas.  You're going to be using this to design-your-own "big photo"
that consists of your desired compositional layout of one, two (or
several) of your non-standard panoramas or whatever.

Step 3:  Populate the blank canvas from Step 2.  Don't worry about the
background yet.  FYI, it is best to work in layers.  Also note that
you can also mix in some standard ratio stuff too, if you wish.    For
example, you could take two of your horizontal panoramics and copy/
paste them into your "big photo" with a gap separating them.

Step 4:  Using what you picked up in Step 1, go fill in the background
of your "big photo" from Step 3 with the same sort of background that
the template software uses.   Similarly, copy any white pictureframe
edges, etc.  Whatever you want.

At this point, you should have a saved image that looks like an entire
completed page out of the template software, with the exception being
whatever you chose to do layout-wise that is beyond what the template
software supports.

Step 5:   When you're satisfied with the results, save the image, then
flatten the image and use "Save As" to create a JPG (or whatever the
template software will support) for the next step.

Step 6:  Import your image from Step 5 into whatever template software
you're using.

Step 7:  Within the template software, go to the desired insertion
location, and choose the relevant "fill entire page with one picture"
template option.

Step 8:  Drag-n-Drop or otherwise insert the Step 5 completed image
into the  book location identified in Step 7.

Step 9.  Observe results & refine as necessary until you're done.

Overall, this sidesteps the template software's intended goal of
"trying to make things easier", but it is a viable work-around and is
reasonable to do when you only have a few special pages.  You'll want
to see the final results in a printed hardcopy before you know you'll
be fully satisfied with it.

-hh
-hh - 22 Jan 2008 20:32 GMT
A quick PS:

The "fill entire page with one photo" option I was referring to in
iPhoto produces a borderless whole page image fill.   Key
clarification is on it being borderless.

For example, see page 6, 7, 12 (sort of), 16, 20, 31, 36, etc. in this
URL:

http://www.huntzinger.com/photo/2006/Tanzania_album-2006s.pdf

-hh

> > I came back from holiday with some great pics, and a LOT of 3 pic
> > panoramics from my Kodak Z712IS.
[quoted text clipped - 60 lines]
>
> -hh
digitaltoast - 24 Jan 2008 18:28 GMT
> Within iPhoto (and probably most of the others), there's the option to
> completely fill an entire page with one image.  You can use this
> option to "cheat":
[snip]

Thanks for that suggestion - I'd thought of it before, but hadn't
really thought out just how complicated it might be!
But I've saved that tip, because you have detailed it really well!
In the end, I found one - Tescophoto.com. When I first read about it,
I didn't see that it could do it, but having downloaded the software,
I see now that it can be totally freeform.
I didn't want to be downloading every single 20mb page designer from
every single printer!
However, it's one of the more expensive book printers, so I might wait
for another promotion (I just missed one!)
So that answers my own question (but it's probably UK only, which is
OK for me).
-hh - 24 Jan 2008 22:05 GMT
> > Within iPhoto (and probably most of the others), there's the option to
> > completely fill an entire page with one image.  You can use this
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> really thought out just how complicated it might be!
> But I've saved that tip, because you have detailed it really well!

My pleasure.

It can be a bit of a nuisance at first, but once you've made up the
basic template, populating it with the same 'unusual' form (eg, your
panoramics) is pretty straightforward ... overall, this is one of
those circumstances where basic human laziness prompts us to minimize
our choices down to fewer custom templates :-)

FWIW, something that I've not yet tried is to set up a two page
spread, where the intent is to is to take a panoramic (or other stuff)
and span it aross two pages.  Allignment at the seam is a managed
risk, but I don't see any reason why it shouldn't work.

My thoughts here would be to:
- start with a "two page" sized canvas
- create the entire "two page" spread
- save
- open original
- crop out the right half & save as new name ("Left Page")
- open original
- crop out the left half & save as new name ("Right Page")
- insert Left & Right pages into template software (as per prior).

While working with such a large canvas might really be slow on one's
PC, I see the approach as probably the most foolproof way to minimize
any page-to-page seam misallignments.

-hh
digitaltoast - 29 Jan 2008 09:14 GMT
Found another that allows freeform, if anyone's interested:
http://www.aldiphotos.co.uk/
ongar_route@hotmail.com - 31 Jan 2008 20:00 GMT
Foto.com also allow free-form layout, if you download their photo book
editor software.

Pretty good service too, not the fastest, but OK.
Chris Pisarra - 23 Jan 2008 01:54 GMT
I'm making a book right now with MPix.com--I don't know if they ship to
the UK or not.

   You can place any size or shape frame or photo on a page, and make it as
large or small or oblong or square as you like.

                               Chris
 
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