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Photo Forum / Digital Photography / DSLR Cameras / October 2007Paranoid goons on dpreview Olympus SLR forum drive another person away
The annoying thing is, because the site really exists to sell product, as long as the goons don't slag the cameras and only the patrons, Phil and his ilk won't even chide them for attacking people. It really is trying, reading it and every single person who points out some shortcoming of the Olympus gear versus the competition is attacked as a "troll." Balanced, civilized discussion is nearly impossible. The really pathetic thing is that the stalwart Oly boosters spend their time pretending there isn't a serious problem (the main one Olympus has) with the DR of the 10 meg cameras. Nearly every shot you see posted with things like clouds, light coloured areas in sunshine are blown to bits, 255 and no detail, yet it is all the user's fault. Funny you don't see this with Canon, Pentax, Nikon, or for that matter, older Olympus models like the E-330 and E-1. http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1022&thread=25320069 > The annoying thing is, because the site really exists to sell product, > as long as the goons don't slag the cameras and only the patrons, Phil [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1022&thread=25320069 Gee, you are attacked as a troll, who would have guessed. Scott > > The annoying thing is, because the site really exists to sell product, > > as long as the goons don't slag the cameras and only the patrons, Phil [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > Scott As long as someone is just relaying information, why does the camera "Gestapo" have to try to stop them? >>> The annoying thing is, because the site really exists to sell product, >>> as long as the goons don't slag the cameras and only the patrons, Phil [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > As long as someone is just relaying information, why does the camera > "Gestapo" have to try to stop them? Your subject lines are about as troll like as you can get, a few from the past. "PROOF of dpreview's horrible pro Canon bias" "Why Olympus? The HORROR of sensor cleaning " "Dust is a HORROR I do NOT want to see again" "Canon 1DMkIII focus error HORROR continues" And then on of your best "Don't buy a plastic camera if you have a prostate!" Scott > "Don't buy a plastic camera if you have a prostate!" Not only trollish, but sexist, too. Terrible. > >>> The annoying thing is, because the site really exists to sell product, > >>> as long as the goons don't slag the cameras and only the patrons, Phil [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > > Scott This is usenet, those headers are "provocative" and I've never posted anything like them on dpreview. Besides, if someone here responds in kind, and they are right, it doesn't bother me at all. What DOES bother me is intolerance of the truth and opinion as demonstrated on dpreview, and "selective" treatment that is highly unfair. Part of the rules state, no personal attacks and yet that is exactly what the kook boosters DO on dpreview! But as I've stated, the site exists to sell equipment and they are "pro" the equipment so they are tolerated, no matter what they say. >... What DOES > bother me is intolerance of the truth and opinion Maybe if you knew the difference between truth and opinion and took care to explain when you were expressing a truth vs an opinion, you would receive a lot more respect.  SignatureJoseph Meehan Dia 's Muire duit > What DOES bother me is intolerance of the truth and opinion Like your egregios claims about, say, plastics? > as demonstrated on dpreview, Like not claiming the DSLR market leader (Canon, 46.7% in 2006, down from 49.5 in 2005) is complete crap and not claiming the second's (Nikon, 33% in 2006, down from 33.7% in 2005) sh.t doesn't stink? > and "selective" treatment that is highly unfair. Meaning they don't agree with you. > Part of > the rules state, no personal attacks and yet that is exactly what the > kook boosters DO on dpreview! Having a different opinion from you is a personal attack, now? Or is it only a personal attack if one is right? > But as I've stated, the site exists to sell equipment and they are > "pro" the equipment so they are tolerated, no matter what they say. But as I stated, RichA exists as a severely mental disturbed person with a chip the size of the Empire State building on it's shoulder, and tolerates anyone who agrees with it, no matter what they say. -Wolfgang On Oct 27, 5:50 pm, Wolfgang Weisselberg <ozcvgt...@sneakemail.com> wrote: > > What DOES bother me is intolerance of the truth and opinion > [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > Having a different opinion from you is a personal attack, now? > Or is it only a personal attack if one is right? No, a personal attack is an attack. Why don't you go back and read them? I though you Germans were fans of precision? >The annoying thing is, because the site really exists to sell product, >as long as the goons don't slag the cameras and only the patrons, Phil >and his ilk won't even chide them for attacking people. What was the reason you are banned? >It really is trying, reading it and every single person who points out >some shortcoming of the Olympus gear versus the competition is >attacked as a "troll." Balanced, civilized discussion is nearly >impossible. More than 10,000 messages are posted to DPR forums each day. Any open discussion with that much volume and that many participants there are certain things you have to expect and accept. These include: 1. Some people will say and do things nearly everyone will find blatantly inappropriate. 2. Some people will say and do things that some people find inappropriate. 3. Some people will post messages with the intent to hurt, anger offend or annoy someone else. 4. Without meaning to, some people will post messages that hurt, anger offend or annoy someone else. 5. Some people will be hurt, angered, offended or annoyed by messages that weren't intended to be hurtful, offensive or annoying. I've seen flamewars erupt over someone responding to a question with RTFM, and I've seen it escalate to the point it polarized the froup. >The really pathetic thing is that the stalwart Oly >boosters spend their time pretending there isn't a serious problem >(the main one Olympus has) with the DR of the 10 meg cameras. Some people would not consider a comment that starts with "The really pathetic thing" to be "balanced, civilized discussion." They would consider the "Paranoid goons" subject line to be trollish. >Nearly >every shot you see posted with things like clouds, light coloured >areas in sunshine are blown to bits, 255 and no detail, yet it is all >the user's fault. In most cases I blame blown highlights and lost shadow detail on bad technique. Sometimes there are too many problems with the scene that it's impossible to capture everything the eye sees. Many times it's possible to salvage a problem image in post-processing. I'm sure the cameras in question have a wider dynamic range than film. Let's see what happens when hand a camera loaded with Velvia 50 to a blame-it-on-the-camera photographer. >Funny you don't see this with Canon, Pentax, Nikon, >or for that matter, older Olympus models like the E-330 and E-1. > >http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1022&thread=25320069 You don't see what? Complaints about dynamic range? Attributing problems to User Error? Personal attacks? TR > >The annoying thing is, because the site really exists to sell product, > >as long as the goons don't slag the cameras and only the patrons, Phil > >and his ilk won't even chide them for attacking people. > > What was the reason you are banned? Dpreview does not disclose why. > >It really is trying, reading it and every single person who points out > >some shortcoming of the Olympus gear versus the competition is [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > I've seen flamewars erupt over someone responding to a question with > RTFM, and I've seen it escalate to the point it polarized the froup. Which is irrationality at its height, IMO. > >The really pathetic thing is that the stalwart Oly > >boosters spend their time pretending there isn't a serious problem [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > pathetic thing" to be "balanced, civilized discussion." They would > consider the "Paranoid goons" subject line to be trollish. Fair enough, the worst I ever did on the group was say that some people were too emotionally invested in their equipment and it effected their logical judgement. It doesn't even take that kind of blatant language to set the kooks off. As you've already pointed out. > >Nearly > >every shot you see posted with things like clouds, light coloured [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > Let's see what happens when hand a camera loaded with Velvia 50 to a > blame-it-on-the-camera photographer. I have no idea about comparison with that film. But saying "it's good enough" when every other camera is better when it comes to DR....well, which would you spend $1000 on? I think it would have served anyone better (than attacking someone who pointed it out) to have said, "yes, it has narrow DR, but I value other features of the camera more, such as (for e.g.) the working dust reduction system." > >Funny you don't see this with Canon, Pentax, Nikon, > >or for that matter, older Olympus models like the E-330 and E-1. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > TR The DR problem is what I'm referring to. Point being that it is far less pronounced on the Olympus models with larger pixels than on the new 10 meg models. Nearly every review of the Olympus 10 meg models has said they lack DR. With the new Canon 40D extending DR even wider, it becomes even more glaring a flaw. > It really is trying, reading it and every single person who points out > some shortcoming of the Olympus gear versus the competition is > attacked as a "troll." Pot, Kettle, Black. -Wolfgang |
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