Photo Forum / Digital Photography / DSLR Cameras / February 2007
D80 -- memory card question..
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maya - 24 Feb 2007 12:01 GMT hi,
I just purchased a memory card, it's a 2GB Toshiba (in list of approved brands for Nikon D80 in manual) tested, it works fine, only weird thing is in display where it usu. says how many photos you can still take instead of saying "900" or something like that it says "1.0" (card is 2GB..) why display is different with this card and how can I tell how many photos I can still take (I know this depends on quality, dimensions setting, but still, why does it say "1.0" instead of how many photos..)
thank you very much...
Joan - 24 Feb 2007 12:26 GMT Do you have a file type/size setting that would allow the card to hold more than 999 photos?
The display can only show 3 digits, so if your card has space for more than 999 photos then the display will show the number in thousands.
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: hi, : [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] : : thank you very much... TJWilson - 24 Feb 2007 15:48 GMT You can test this by changing the quality of image to something which creates a larger files size. Joan is correct the 1.0 means over 1000 but less than 1,100, the larger file size setting should drop the number down to display in 3 digits.
maya - 26 Feb 2007 12:29 GMT > Do you have a file type/size setting that would allow thecardto hold > more than 999 photos? [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > : > : thank you very much... oh my gosh.. thank you VERY much.....:)
Paige Miller - 24 Feb 2007 16:38 GMT > hi, > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > thank you very much... My Nikon D80 displays a little "K" to the right of the 1.0 and slightly above the 1.0 to indicate that you can take 1K (i.e. 1,000) photos. There is no way for the camera to display more decimal places, so you can assume there are between 1000 and 1099 photos left. Once the number of photos left falls under 1000, it will display the estimated number of photos, such as, for example, 962.
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It's nothing until I call it -- Bill Klem, NL Umpire If you get the choice to sit it out or dance, I hope you dance -- Lee Ann Womack
THO - 24 Feb 2007 17:14 GMT > My Nikon D80 displays a little "K" to the right of the 1.0 and > slightly above the 1.0 to indicate that you can take 1K (i.e. 1,000) > photos. There is no way for the camera to display more decimal places, > so you can assume there are between 1000 and 1099 photos left. Once > the number of photos left falls under 1000, it will display the > estimated number of photos, such as, for example, 962. I wonder why they don't at a "+" after the 1K -- 1K+ to accurately represent that there is more than 1,000 photos remaining.
Paige Miller - 24 Feb 2007 20:18 GMT >> My Nikon D80 displays a little "K" to the right of the 1.0 and >> slightly above the 1.0 to indicate that you can take 1K (i.e. 1,000) [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > I wonder why they don't at a "+" after the 1K -- 1K+ to accurately > represent that there is more than 1,000 photos remaining. This makes no sense. The "K" indicates there are 1000 or more (up to 1099) photos remaining. The "+" that you suggest adds no additional information.
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It's nothing until I call it -- Bill Klem, NL Umpire If you get the choice to sit it out or dance, I hope you dance -- Lee Ann Womack
THO - 24 Feb 2007 20:50 GMT > >> My Nikon D80 displays a little "K" to the right of the 1.0 and > >> slightly above the 1.0 to indicate that you can take 1K (i.e. 1,000) [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > 1099) photos remaining. The "+" that you suggest adds no additional > information. K=1,000 1K=1,000 2K=2,000 3K=3,000
In this care ...
1K= 1,000 (not 1,000 to 1,999) 1K+= more than 1K
If your camera displayed 1, would that mean you had between 1 and 999 shots remaining?
Paige Miller - 25 Feb 2007 14:46 GMT >>>> My Nikon D80 displays a little "K" to the right of the 1.0 and >>>> slightly above the 1.0 to indicate that you can take 1K (i.e. 1,000) [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > 1K= 1,000 (not 1,000 to 1,999) > 1K+= more than 1K No, wrong
1.0K =1,000 to 1,099 pics 1.1K =1,100 to 1,199 pics ... 1.9K =1,900 to 1,999 pics 2.0K =2,000 to 2,099 pics 2.1K =2,100 to 2,199 pics
etc
The plus sign tells you nothing
> If your camera displayed 1, would that mean you had between 1 and 999 > shots remaining? It means you have 1 picture, that's the way the Nikon D80 works. If there's no "K", then that's the estimated number of pictures. If there's a "K", there's a range. The "+" would tell you nothing
 Signature Paige Miller pmiller5@rochester.rr.com
It's nothing until I call it -- Bill Klem, NL Umpire If you get the choice to sit it out or dance, I hope you dance -- Lee Ann Womack
THO - 25 Feb 2007 15:26 GMT > 1.0K =1,000 to 1,099 pics > 1.1K =1,100 to 1,199 pics > ... > 1.9K =1,900 to 1,999 pics > 2.0K =2,000 to 2,099 pics > 2.1K =2,100 to 2,199 pics Paige, you skipped school on the day your 4th grade teacher taught the metric system, didn't you?
Just because Nikon uses that convention doesn't make it right. Let's take the "K" out of the equation:
1,000=1,000 1,000 does not equal 1,000 to 1,099 1,100=1,100 1,100 does not equal 1,100 to 1,199
Paige Miller - 25 Feb 2007 16:36 GMT >> 1.0K =1,000 to 1,099 pics >> 1.1K =1,100 to 1,199 pics [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > 1,100=1,100 > 1,100 does not equal 1,100 to 1,199 Can't you understand the idea of limited space forces Nikon to use approximations? It's not the metric system that Nikon is using, its the Nikon D80 abbreviations that it is using. That's why 1.0K on a Nikon D80 indicates there is space on the SD card for between 1000 and 1099 shots available. How do I know? Because the camera shows 1.0K, I take 30 or 40 shots and then magically, the camera no longer reads 1.0K -- the camera tells me there are 999 shots left.
But don't take my word for it. Look at the manual for the D80 http://www.nikonusa.com/pdf/manuals/noprint/D80_noprint.pdf and scroll down to page 17 of the .pdf (which oddly is page 5 of the manual as many of the early pages have Roman numerals)
 Signature Paige Miller pmiller5@rochester.rr.com
It's nothing until I call it -- Bill Klem, NL Umpire If you get the choice to sit it out or dance, I hope you dance -- Lee Ann Womack
THO - 25 Feb 2007 19:17 GMT > >> 1.0K =1,000 to 1,099 pics > >> 1.1K =1,100 to 1,199 pics [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > Can't you understand the idea of limited space forces Nikon to use > approximations? It's not the metric system that Nikon is using, its <Sigh> Here you go - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kilo
Most people first learn about this when they learn about the metric system.
Here's what you're not getting ---
999 = 3 characters 1K=2 characters 1K+=3 characters (i.e. it FITS into Nikon's 3 character display and would allow them to use an abbreviation that is CORRECT instead of written in Nikon-speak)
> the Nikon D80 abbreviations that it is using. That's why 1.0K on a > Nikon D80 indicates there is space on the SD card for between 1000 and [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > and scroll down to page 17 of the .pdf (which oddly is page 5 of the > manual as many of the early pages have Roman numerals) Paige Miller - 25 Feb 2007 20:23 GMT > Here's what you're not getting --- > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > would allow them to use an abbreviation that is CORRECT instead of > written in Nikon-speak) Yeah but that's not what Nikon did, and your system with the "+" sign conveys no additional information over and above what Nikon did. By the way, the Nikon D80 does not us 1K as you imply above. It uses 1.0K, conveying more information than your 1K+. Your 1K+ indicates 1000-1999 photos, it cannot indicate finer gradations, whereas Nikon can indicate via 1.2K that there are only 1200-1299 photos.
Your statement about CORRECT is ridiculous, Nikon wasn't trying to emulate the metric system, they were trying to convey as much information as possible and they did so with better effectiveness than using 1K+.
 Signature Paige Miller pmiller5@rochester.rr.com
It's nothing until I call it -- Bill Klem, NL Umpire If you get the choice to sit it out or dance, I hope you dance -- Lee Ann Womack
Dr Hfuhruhurr - 26 Feb 2007 09:17 GMT > In article <45e1baee$0$16664$4c368...@roadrunner.com>, > [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > would allow them to use an abbreviation that is CORRECT instead of > written in Nikon-speak) No no no no no. Paige is trying to explain, to you, what Nikon display on the D80 where there are more than 999 photos remaining with the current size settings. And you know what, Paige is absolutely correct. Never mind whether Nikon doesn't use the correct metric respresentation of K or not, this is what the camera shows.
Capiche?
Doc
DoN. Nichols - 28 Feb 2007 04:21 GMT According to THO <tho@tho.tho.23.invalid>:
> > >> 1.0K =1,000 to 1,099 pics > > >> 1.1K =1,100 to 1,199 pics [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > would allow them to use an abbreviation that is CORRECT instead of > written in Nikon-speak) Because when the larger SD cards come out (like the 4GB CF card which I have in my D70), and when you switch to the smallest image format with the most compression, you exceed 10,000 estimated images (as I posted just a bit back -- but after you had written this), under such circumstances my D70 with a 4GB CF card says that it can get 15.1K, so where is your space for the '+ sign now? Oh -- you want to have to send your camera in for reprogramming when the SD cards reach 4GB in size, so you can have your '+' until then? And remember that last position is *not* the images of all the digits from 0 through 9 -- it is a seven-segment display -- the number is made of bars which are turned on or off -- and you would need to add another bar to get the vertical bar in the middle of the '+' sign.
Forget it -- it is not that important.
Or are you just a troll?
DoN.
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DoN. Nichols - 28 Feb 2007 04:13 GMT According to THO <tho@tho.tho.23.invalid>:
> > 1.0K =1,000 to 1,099 pics > > 1.1K =1,100 to 1,199 pics [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > 1,100=1,100 > 1,100 does not equal 1,100 to 1,199 Well ... there is a difference between 'k' and 'K'. In the computer field, lower case indicates a multiplier of 1000, and upper case indicates a multiplier of 1024 (2^10th). But we can ignore that for the moment.
However, in scientific fields. the use of a 'k' suffix in combination with a decimal point and not sufficient digits to fill out to the end means an approximation or a range -- such as was given above. Think of it as (for the "1.1K") as 1.1 times 1K, and since there is only one digit after the decimal point, it leaves an uncertainty as to the remaining two (missing) digits.
In electronics, you can buy a 1.2K resistor. Does this mean that if you measured it you would get precisely 1,200 ohms? No -- most of these resistors have a tolerance affixed -- with the carbon composition resistors having tolerances of 20%, 10% or 5%, allowing (for the 20% case) a range of from 960 ohms to 1440 ohms. And the actual value changes with the temperature anyway.
This display is just the same. It is a guess (estimate) anyway, nobody knows how many images you will *really* get in there -- and it is almost certainly going to be greater than the number specified (let's assume that the readout is now saying "999" -- a precise number -- but it is almost certainly *wrong*. Nikon has made its estimate on the conservative side, so you can't walk up to them as say "It said that I could get 999 images and I only got 950 images -- your camera is defective."
Nikon does not *owe* you, me, or anyone else, a precise count, and the manual (you do read the manuals, don't you?) will tell you that it is a rough indication (and will tell you the range which given indication covers). Since there is no way to be certain of how many images it will actually hold until they are taken, what is the need for wasting space on the top readout to try to be more precise.
Why not simply assume that the 'k' displayed is actually a distorted '+' and forget this thread?
Enjoy, DoN.
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DoN. Nichols - 28 Feb 2007 03:58 GMT According to THO <tho@tho.tho.23.invalid>:
[ ... ]
> > > I wonder why they don't at a "+" after the 1K -- 1K+ to accurately > > > represent that there is more than 1,000 photos remaining. [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > If your camera displayed 1, would that mean you had between 1 and 999 > shots remaining? My D70 (with a 4GB CF card and currently set on "Large/Fine") reads "1.1" (with a tiny 'K' above the last digit) not just "1" with a "K"'. This means to me that it will take somewhere between 1100 and 1199 photos (estimated) before running out of memory. (In reality, it will probably take a lot more based on experience with 1GB CF cards.)
If mine displayed "1", I would assume that there was room for only one more photo at the current settings. If it read "1.0K", I would assume that it meant somewhere between 1000 and 1099 shots.
What does the '+' offer which is not already implied by the 'K'? You know that once it displays a 'K', it *can't* display the exact number of images left -- even if it *could* accurately guess the number. (It can't because different JPEG images will compress to different amounts, even with the "Fine" option turned on, and there is even some variation with the RAW (NEF) images. So even when it is saying "999", it is saying in reality that you can get *at* *least* 999 images, and probably significantly more.
FWIW -- if I switch to "Basic/Small" as my quality setting, the displayed number is 15.1K. RAW takes it down to 718, and RAW+Basic to 638.
Note that if you actually *shoot* over 1000 images, it will split your card up into multiple folders, each with no more than 999 images.
Enjoy, DoN.
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Doug Payne - 24 Feb 2007 21:29 GMT >> My Nikon D80 displays a little "K" to the right of the 1.0 and >> slightly above the 1.0 to indicate that you can take 1K (i.e. 1,000) [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > I wonder why they don't at a "+" after the 1K -- 1K+ to accurately > represent that there is more than 1,000 photos remaining. If you have 1,000 or more shots remaining, does it really matter if it's 1,001 or 1,099? In any case, it's only an approximation; there's no way the camera can know exactly how many shots will fit in almost all cases.
Alan Browne - 26 Feb 2007 11:47 GMT >> I wonder why they don't at a "+" after the 1K -- 1K+ to accurately >> represent that there is more than 1,000 photos remaining. > > If you have 1,000 or more shots remaining, does it really matter if it's > 1,001 or 1,099? In any case, it's only an approximation; there's no way > the camera can know exactly how many shots will fit in almost all cases. Psst. Useful posts damage the newsgroup.
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Doug Payne - 26 Feb 2007 12:46 GMT > Psst. Useful posts damage the newsgroup. That's my sole purpose here.
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