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Photo Forum / Digital Photography / DSLR Cameras / August 2006

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Adobe lightroom

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Padu - 18 Aug 2006 07:54 GMT
I'm sorry if it's been discussed before, but what do you guys think or adobe
lightroom (from adobe labs, the same folks that were macromedia labs one
day)?
I know, it's still beta (nowadays some products never leave beta... go
figure...) but I'm enjoying. A few quirks here and there, but very nice
looking and nice features.

Cheers

Padu
Mark² - 18 Aug 2006 11:02 GMT
> I'm sorry if it's been discussed before, but what do you guys think
> or adobe lightroom (from adobe labs, the same folks that were
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>
> Padu

Adobe just bought out the excellent RawShooter Essential/Premium company to
supposedly incorporate its technology/engine into Lightroom...so...assuming
Adobe doesn't entirely screw it up...and assuming they bought it to actually
USE it, rather than simply to smash the mostly FREE competition...it could
be very decent.

I'll wait and see because for one...I already have RawShooter Premium and
I'm happy with it.  They'll have to significantly improve on it, or perhaps
make it seamlessly FAST for use with Photoshop...and then I'll be
interested.

I just hope they don't anihilate its ease of use and straight-forward
interface...

-Mark²

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Images (Plus Snaps & Grabs) by Mark² at:
       www.pbase.com/markuson

Thomas T. Veldhouse - 18 Aug 2006 13:29 GMT
"Mark?" <mjmorgan(lowest even number here)@cox..net> wrote:
> I just hope they don't anihilate its ease of use and straight-forward
> interface...

I have never found Raw Shooter to have a straight-forward interface.  I also
am a Premium owner, but use other software much of the time as they still
don't have it together with curves and layers.

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Thomas T. Veldhouse
Key Fingerprint: 2DB9 813F F510 82C2 E1AE  34D0 D69D 1EDC D5EC AED1

Padu - 18 Aug 2006 16:22 GMT
"Thomas T. Veldhouse"
> "Mark?" <mjmorgan(lowest even number here)@cox..net> wrote:
>> I just hope they don't anihilate its ease of use and straight-forward
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> am a Premium owner, but use other software much of the time as they still
> don't have it together with curves and layers.

I'm a software engineer, and from the engineering standpoint, I liked the
UI. It is still a bit slow, but I cannot judge that, since I was using the
software while it was cataloging my pictures (about 8K) on the background.

The folks at adobe labs say (in a presentation video) that the final version
is going to have many more useful features. I liked the quick develop a lot,
looks very powerful. The editing you do is non-destructive, to commit to
changes you have to open it in photoshop, when it will ask you if you want
to carry the changes with the image.

For now it's free, I'm not sure if it will stay like that, but I guess so.

Cheers

Padu
Thomas T. Veldhouse - 18 Aug 2006 17:46 GMT
> "Thomas T. Veldhouse"
>> "Mark?" <mjmorgan(lowest even number here)@cox..net> wrote:
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> UI. It is still a bit slow, but I cannot judge that, since I was using the
> software while it was cataloging my pictures (about 8K) on the background.

I am a software engineer (and consultant) as well ... and I found the UI less
than intuitive, and that is why I refered to it as such.  As far as slow goes,
I actually found it to be quite fast as compared to other products like any of
the Adobe offerings.

> The folks at adobe labs say (in a presentation video) that the final version
> is going to have many more useful features. I liked the quick develop a lot,
> looks very powerful. The editing you do is non-destructive, to commit to
> changes you have to open it in photoshop, when it will ask you if you want
> to carry the changes with the image.

I haven't given lightroom any real effort as of yet to understand what it is
supposed to do and how it will do it.

> For now it's free, I'm not sure if it will stay like that, but I guess so.

Lightroom?  No, it won't be free, in fact, I read [somewhere] that it would be
more expensive than Rawshooter Premium, but that the price point has yet to be
decided.

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Thomas T. Veldhouse
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bmoag - 18 Aug 2006 18:47 GMT
I have Raw Shooter Premium, along with a few other converters, but use them
less and less. The general reason that I find stand-alone raw converters
somewhat unsatisfactory is that, at least for my non-professional habits,
the global adjustments that one can make to an image in a stand alone
converter are rarely enough and regional adjustments to part of an image is
still required in Photoshop. While some adjustments initially seem easier in
some raw converters I have not found anything that cannot be duplicated in
CS2.
The specific problem I have with Raw Shooter Premium is that the appearance
of an image in its preview window is significantly different, particularly
with regard to contrast and gamma but not color, than how that image looks
when it is opened in CS2. Since I print from CS2 and my color management
routine provides satisfactorily predictable results RSP is often not worth
using. Bibble, Dx and Nikon NX do not show these shifts in image quality
when opening the image in CS2. Nikon NX with its control points may be on to
a new and usable interface for image adjustment but I see it as a work in
progress.
From a marketing standpoint I really do not understand why Adobe would want
to insert the functionality of Raw Shooter Premium into Lightroom. My
limited experience with Lightroom has me wondering how Adobe plans to market
it in relationship to CS2. My major impression of Lightroom is that it is
merely Bridge on steroids. Lightroom has a nicer interface for making
limited global adjustments to groups of images made in a studio under
identical lighting conditions but I don't immediately see what you can do
with Lightroom that you can't already do in CS2.
I suspect Adobe also is not clear how they can market this product and that
is why it is out there as a free beta. Adobe might have thought they needed
to have something to compete with Aperture but that ill-starred product is
not likely to survive due to bizarre programing and marketing by Apple. For
example how could Apple release Aperture at the same time as the Mactel and
not have a  version native to the Mactel OS--as of this writing the number
of programs that run native to the Mactel OS makes those Mactel boxes the
most overpriced and underwarrantied  Wintel clones in the marketplace.
Padu - 18 Aug 2006 19:42 GMT
"bmoag"
<snip>
> limited experience with Lightroom has me wondering how Adobe plans to
> market it in relationship to CS2. My major impression of Lightroom is that
> it is merely Bridge on steroids. Lightroom has a nicer interface for
> making limited global adjustments to groups of images made in a studio
> under identical lighting conditions but I don't immediately see what you
> can do with Lightroom that you can't already do in CS2.
<snip>

I had that impression too... bridge on steroids, but lacks the file
management features (moving files around), while bridge lacks the developing
features... if only they could combine both. I have the impression that
lightroom will be free or bundled with next versions of photoshop.
I don't think lightroom is supposed to replace CS2, only to complement.
no_name - 18 Aug 2006 20:51 GMT
> "bmoag"
> <snip>
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
> lightroom will be free or bundled with next versions of photoshop.
> I don't think lightroom is supposed to replace CS2, only to complement.

Maybe you've hit it, that the next version of Photoshop will have
Lightroom combined with Bridge to give the best of both.

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These are my views. If you've got a problem with it, you can blame it on
me, but this is what I think. I am not the official spokes-person for
any Government, Commercial or Educational institution.

John

Tim - 19 Aug 2006 01:59 GMT
> I suspect Adobe also is not clear how they can market this product and that
> is why it is out there as a free beta. Adobe might have thought they needed
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> of programs that run native to the Mactel OS makes those Mactel boxes the
> most overpriced and underwarrantied  Wintel clones in the marketplace.

The fact that Aperture isn't native today isn't going to have any impact
on it's long-term success. Soon enough it will be native, as will all
the other major apps. Software development cycles don't match hardware
development cycles. The transition to Intel hardware is a major
transition and it takes time for software products to catch up. We
certainly aren't going to see all Windows applications updated for VISTA
within several months of its release.
Thomas T. Veldhouse - 21 Aug 2006 13:48 GMT
>> I suspect Adobe also is not clear how they can market this product and that
>> is why it is out there as a free beta. Adobe might have thought they needed
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
> certainly aren't going to see all Windows applications updated for VISTA
> within several months of its release.

Vista is not a platform upgrade, it is an OS upgrade of the same OS.  Most
software will work 100% as well on Vista as it does on XP.  There will be
exceptions, but very few of them.

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Thomas T. Veldhouse
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cjcampbell - 21 Aug 2006 04:48 GMT
> I suspect Adobe also is not clear how they can market this product and that
> is why it is out there as a free beta. Adobe might have thought they needed
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> of programs that run native to the Mactel OS makes those Mactel boxes the
> most overpriced and underwarrantied  Wintel clones in the marketplace.

Everyone here is well aware of your "Apple can do no right" theme. If
Apple had never switched to Intel, you would still be going on about
the inferior processor. Now that they have switched, you are spinning
it as a bad move. No matter what Apple does, it seems that you think it
was the wrong move. Overall, your ignorance and outright defamatory
postings have become more than tiresome.

Apples have warranties, contrary to your defamatory insistence that
they do not.

They are not intended to be Wintel clones.

It is highly doubtful that they are the most overpriced Intel computer
on the market.

Aperture has its faults, but you probably have no idea what they are.

You are possibly the most ignorant, biased, and stupid jerk posting
here. And that is really going some.
John McWilliams - 21 Aug 2006 16:36 GMT
>> I suspect Adobe also is not clear how they can market this product and that
>> is why it is out there as a free beta. Adobe might have thought they needed
[quoted text clipped - 24 lines]
> You are possibly the most ignorant, biased, and stupid jerk posting
> here. And that is really going some.

No, he's not, not by a long shot. But what you say about his anti-Mac
rants is right and right on. Tiresome and predictable, with more than a
dash of unsupportable statements and bias thrown in.

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John McWilliams

 
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