 |
 | Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us |
 | Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network |
| PhotoKB HomeDiscussion Groups Digital Photography Digital PhotoDSLR CamerasZLR CamerasPoint & Shoot CamerasFilm Photography 35 mmLarge FormatMedium formatDarkroomFilm and LabsOther EquipmentPhoto Technique Nature PhotographyPeople PhotographyTechnique GeneralGeneral Photo Topics General TopicsAustralian PhotographyUK PhotographyDirectoryPhoto Clubs |
Photo Forum / Digital Photography / DSLR Cameras / June 2006Sony's new 10 meg $999 DSLR
http://tinyurl.com/kmaus > http://tinyurl.com/kmaus Just an added note, there seems to be no equivalent to the R-1 lens for this DSLR. There is a 16-80mm Zeiss lens as an option, but it is slower than the R-1's integrated lens. > > http://tinyurl.com/kmaus > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > than > the R-1's integrated lens. Since this one has a mirror in the way you can't use the same lens that is on the R-1. That is one very large advantage that a non-slr camera has, much shorter working distance between the lens to the sensor. The same holds true for range finder cameras. Scott > > > http://tinyurl.com/kmaus > > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > Scott I didnt know that the R-1s lens was one of those kind that went all the way back into the camera like some other P&S models. It would have been interesting to see what kind of price the R-1 lens would have been apart from the camera. Some people figured around $1000 just for the lens because of its zoom range, and its speed. > > > > http://tinyurl.com/kmaus > > > [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > Some people figured around $1000 just for the lens because of its zoom > range, and its speed. But that is the point, you could not just rip out the R-1 lens, put it in a new mount, and use it on an existing DSLR. Note that Canon even makes use of the shorter working distance on the 30D, 20D and Rebel cameras and has lenses that will only fit them. A telephoto lens does not need the short working distance but when you get to a wide angle lens life is much easier (cheaper) if you can get the last element close to the sensor/film. Scott "Scott W" <biphoto@hotmail.com> wrote in message > Note that Canon even makes use of the shorter working distance on the > 30D, 20D and Rebel cameras and has lenses that will only fit them. > > A telephoto lens does not need the short working distance but when you > get to a wide angle lens life is much easier (cheaper) if you can get > the last element close to the sensor/film. no sign of the antishake what gives? Thank god they keep compact flash so you aren't stuck witht the memory shtick. > "Scott W" <biphoto@hotmail.com> wrote in message > > Note that Canon even makes use of the shorter working distance on the [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > no sign of the antishake what gives? Thank god they keep compact flash so > you aren't stuck witht the memory shtick. If you look at the features tab you will see that antishake is in fact there. I agree about the compact flash, memory sticks were just a bad idea from the start. Scott > http://tinyurl.com/kmaus The requested product is no longer available Talk about a short product life !!! > > http://tinyurl.com/kmaus > > The requested product is no longer available > > Talk about a short product life !!! j/k It's on DPReview now, looks good. >> > http://tinyurl.com/kmaus >> [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >It's on DPReview now, looks good. If this is Sony's "entry-level" product, I can only wonder what their high-end product will be like. SNIP > If this is Sony's "entry-level" product, I can only wonder > what their high-end product will be like. Have you seen its image results? Going for a CCD indicates they are trying to avoid noise issues, requiring the larger per pixel fill-factor. The bucket-brigade style of reading the chip means that errors will propagate and cumulate, thus one edge of the image is worse than the other. Maybe they read in multiple blocks which requires more circuitry and more power. Another way to prevent the longger read time, is by using faster electronics which consume more power. Let's see some results first, shall we? Bart > Going for a CCD indicates they are trying to avoid noise issues, > requiring the larger per pixel fill-factor. The bucket-brigade style of > reading the chip means that errors will propagate and cumulate, thus one > edge of the image is worse than the other. Maybe they read in multiple Unless it reads alternate columns off in different directions like the D200, resulting in slight patterning to the noise at the edges (really, noise only on alternate lines so that the noise forms faint bands at the edges of the image in the deep shadows). > SNIP > > If this is Sony's "entry-level" product, I can only wonder [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > Let's see some results first, shall we? >If they used the same sensor as the DSC-R1 then it will likely have a lot of shadow noise. We will have to wait to see if they have improved on the R1. Scott >> If they used the same sensor as the DSC-R1 then it will likely have >> a lot of shadow noise. We will have to wait to see if they have >> improved on the R1. Not according to DP Review: http://www.dpreview.com/articles/sonydslra100/ "10 megapixel APS-C CCD Interestingly Sony has gone for CCD rather than CMOS with this camera, so it's not the same sensor as used in the DSC-R1. We've no official confirmation but it seems likely that this is the same 23.6 x 15.8 mm CCD used in the Nikon D200. " David > >> If they used the same sensor as the DSC-R1 then it will likely have > >> a lot of shadow noise. We will have to wait to see if they have [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > confirmation but it seems likely that this is the same 23.6 x 15.8 mm CCD > used in the Nikon D200. " Interesting, if they can get the same preformace as the D200 it will be very good indeed. Scott >>>>If they used the same sensor as the DSC-R1 then it will likely have >>>>a lot of shadow noise. We will have to wait to see if they have [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > Interesting, if they can get the same preformace as the D200 it will be > very good indeed. Lots of features missing but that's OK for the price. Does this take Nikon lenses? "Paul Furman" <paul-@-edgehill.net> wrote in message news:Tx0ig.42496 > Lots of features missing but that's OK for the price. > Does this take Nikon lenses? was that a joke? Its gettting hard to differentiate the pisstakers from the genuine knob ends. > "Paul Furman" <paul-@-edgehill.net> wrote in message news:Tx0ig.42496 > >>Lots of features missing but that's OK for the price. >>Does this take Nikon lenses? > > was that a joke? I didn't see mirror lockup, burst is slow, not sure how nice the viewfinder is, no 3 channel histogram, etc. But it looks great for the price. Anti shake & dust removal is sweet. I thought I recalled Minolta would take Nikon lenses. I don't know, I was asking. I assume it takes old Minolta lenses. >> "Paul Furman" <paul-@-edgehill.net> wrote in message news:Tx0ig.42496 >> [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > I thought I recalled Minolta would take Nikon lenses. I don't know, I was > asking. I assume it takes old Minolta lenses. Didn't see the dust removal. software or olympus style shake it off? Paul Furman (paul-@-edgehill.net) wrote in rec.photo.digital.slr-systems: > I didn't see mirror lockup, burst is slow, not sure how nice the > viewfinder is, no 3 channel histogram, etc. But it looks great for the > price. Anti shake & dust removal is sweet. > > I thought I recalled Minolta would take Nikon lenses. I don't know, I > was asking. I assume it takes old Minolta lenses. It is essentially a Minolta Maxxum 5D with the following upgrades: - more pixels - dust removal - better anti-shake - "Bionz" image processor - 40-segment honeycomb metering - 230,000 pixel color LCD - high capacity Lithium ion battery - adapter that allows you to use Memory Stick Duo in the CF card slot Any lens that works with the 5D or 7D will work with this camera. Any lens that didn't work with the 5D or 7D will almost certainly not work with this camera.  SignatureJeff Rife | | http://www.nabs.net/Cartoons/OverTheHedge/HighTech.gif > It is essentially a Minolta Maxxum 5D with the following upgrades: Jeff- I think the DP Review suggested that their pre-production sample had a glass pentaprism, rather than the pentamirror of the 5D (I think). If the production version is the same, then it isn't really in the 5D category. More like an "8D" without the 7D control. My local Minolta dealer says that he may not be able to carry the Sony camera because they would require him to stock a large portion of the entire Sony line. Does anyone know if they will require that? I'd rather purchase from the local store. Fred >My local Minolta dealer says that he may not be able to carry the Sony >camera because they would require him to stock a large portion of the >entire Sony line. Does anyone know if they will require that? I'd rather >purchase from the local store. My local Minolta dealer said exactly the same. He has no intention of stocking any Sony products other than the DSLRs and the excellent DSC-R1, so he is not going to be able to offer any of the Alpha range. I asked him if he felt that he was letting down his Minolta customer base. He said no, because they had already all left the Minolta brand for Canon, Nikon, Pentax and Olympus DSLRs, all of which he stocks. >>My local Minolta dealer says that he may not be able to carry the Sony >>camera because they would require him to stock a large portion of the [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > base. He said no, because they had already all left the Minolta brand > for Canon, Nikon, Pentax and Olympus DSLRs, all of which he stocks. Since there are well over a million Maxxum/Dynax users who still are using their Maxxum/Dynax' and haven't jumped ship, the above statement is typical of Polson brand bashing. I know at least a dozen local Maxxum shooters (serious shooters who show their work, not Tony Polson types who are all hat and no cattle) who have steadfastly stuck to their kit. Yes, there have been some jumpers to Canon and Nikon. They are quite few in actual fact. And the more serious shooters who have extensive lens and flash systems from Minolta have of course patiently and wisely stayed the course. In the end, where I buy the Sony body is of little importance to me. It's on the B&H site at $999 and $899 (w/ and w/o zoom lens) so there is no big deal about distribution at all. Polson, as usual, is firing blanks. Cheers, Alan. Signature-- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm -- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin -- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch. >>>My local Minolta dealer says that he may not be able to carry the Sony >>>camera because they would require him to stock a large portion of the [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > It's on the B&H site at $999 and $899 (w/ and w/o zoom lens) so there is > no big deal about distribution at all. Now that isn't necessarily true. B&H carries quite a lot of Sony stuff in addition to that camera. If it shows up on Newegg or Buy.com or one of the other pass-through marketers, _then_ one can assume that it's in general distribution, but even there the wholesalers will enforce dealer authorization on the retailer if the manufacturer requires it of them. > Polson, as usual, is firing > blanks. > > Cheers, > Alan. Signature--John to email, dial "usenet" and validate (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net) >>It's on the B&H site at $999 and $899 (w/ and w/o zoom lens) so there is >>no big deal about distribution at all. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > distribution, but even there the wholesalers will enforce dealer > authorization on the retailer if the manufacturer requires it of them. What I meant was that if B&H announce it already before release, it can be delivered almost anywhere in the world within a few days when in stock. I haven't checked, but I'm sure that Adorama will soon (if not already) be offering it. There are dozens of chain electronics/appliance stores here with "all things Sony" and some sell DSLR's. There are also "Sony" stores here which, no doubt, will have the camera. I would prefer, of course, to buy it from one of the few photo stores I frequent, but it's not the end of the world if I can't. Cheers, Alan Signature-- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm -- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin -- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch. >>>It's on the B&H site at $999 and $899 (w/ and w/o zoom lens) so there is >>>no big deal about distribution at all. [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > I would prefer, of course, to buy it from one of the few photo stores I > frequent, but it's not the end of the world if I can't. The thing that I find interesting is that B&H will take an advance order on it--it seems to be the _only_ thing for which they will take such an order. Signature--John to email, dial "usenet" and validate (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net) > The thing that I find interesting is that B&H will take an advance order on > it--it seems to be the _only_ thing for which they will take such an order. B&H have always taken advance orders on DSLRs. They know many photographers are obsessed gearheads who want to be first on their street with the new camera. Cheers, Alan. Signature-- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm -- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin -- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch. >> The thing that I find interesting is that B&H will take an advance order >> on it--it seems to be the _only_ thing for which they will take such an [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > photographers are obsessed gearheads who want to be first on their > street with the new camera. So howcum they won't take an advance order on the new Pentax models or the Nikon D200 or any other out-of-stock DSLR? And howcum there was a long thread recently about how they _won't_ take such orders? > Cheers, > Alan. Signature--John to email, dial "usenet" and validate (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net) > So howcum they won't take an advance order on the new Pentax models or the > Nikon D200 or any other out-of-stock DSLR? And howcum there was a long > thread recently about how they _won't_ take such orders? B&H do for some things such as the A100 and they did for the 7D and 20D IIRC. They have many out of stock items for which they accept orders for delivery on shipment (although some people do not agree with their practice of billing your CC at order time rather than shipping time). You can write to B&H on why they won't for other things. They are very responsive (usually within 2 working days). Cheers, Alan Signature-- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm -- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin -- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch. Fred McKenzie (fmmck@aol.com) wrote in rec.photo.digital.slr-systems: > > It is essentially a Minolta Maxxum 5D with the following upgrades: > > I think the DP Review suggested that their pre-production sample had a > glass pentaprism, rather than the pentamirror of the 5D (I think). If the > production version is the same, then it isn't really in the 5D category. I didn't catch that difference, but it's still much more of a 5D. The 5D had a few nice upgrades to the 7D (white balance bracketing is the one I covet the most), but many of the downgrades (build quality, control setup, 3-shot bracket only, 1EV minimum metering, no battery grip, etc.) seem to be carried over to the Alpha. And, if Sony still hasn't fixed the AWB (which works fine under a lot of conditions, but most artificial indoor lighting gives it fits), then it's *really* no "8D". More on build quality: the Alpha is even *lighter* than the 5D (without the battery, anyway...I can't find any specs on the 5D with battery). SignatureJeff Rife | "One minute we were spanking each other with | meat, and the next minute it got weird." | | -- Joe Hackett, "Wings" >>It is essentially a Minolta Maxxum 5D with the following upgrades: > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > entire Sony line. Does anyone know if they will require that? I'd rather > purchase from the local store. I agree that I'd rather purchase from the three regular local stores I haunt, OTOH it's on the B&H site for $999 and $899 (w/ & w/o zoom lens). Cheers, Alan. Signature-- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm -- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin -- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch. > Going for a CCD indicates they are trying to avoid noise issues, > requiring the larger per pixel fill-factor. The bucket-brigade style of [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Let's see some results first, shall we? Agree, but pre-supposing that Sony (a major chip maker) cannot manage the issues you mention is a bit of a kneejerk response. Signature-- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm -- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin -- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch. SNIP > Agree, but pre-supposing that Sony (a major chip maker) cannot > manage the issues you mention is a bit of a kneejerk response. Basic physics is hard to beat, if at all possible. Besides, I do welcome competition, because ultimately we will benefit from the advances in technology it brings. Bart > SNIP > >> Agree, but pre-supposing that Sony (a major chip maker) cannot manage >> the issues you mention is a bit of a kneejerk response. > > Basic physics is hard to beat, if at all possible. It's not about beating physics. Physics cannot be beat. It can be understood and methods to compensate for behaviour can be devised numerically. Canon do extremely well in this regard; there is no reason that Sony cannot do great as well. > Besides, I do welcome > competition, because ultimately we will benefit from the advances in > technology it brings. Indeed, although if I were Canon or Nikon it would take a serious yell from Sony in the marketplace to upset their dominance. Sony is still a wannabe in the SLR world and the investment (in all respects) to make a serious run at them will be enormous. I do not trust Sony to become a high quality SLR makeer and the A100 is certainly not a help as it is aimed at the consumer, not the amateur or pro. I remain guardedly optimistic in my hopes for Sony in the long term. Cheers, Alan Signature-- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm -- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin -- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch. >> Going for a CCD indicates they are trying to avoid noise issues, >> requiring the larger per pixel fill-factor. The bucket-brigade style [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Agree, but pre-supposing that Sony (a major chip maker) cannot manage > the issues you mention is a bit of a kneejerk response. Well, since CCDs used for astronomical imaging have these problems (at least, so I'm told), and these cost a lot more than an SLR sensor, I'd be surprised if Sony managed to solve them so easily. And it's not as if they just started making and selling CCDs, either, so if they were going to solve them, they'd have probably done it by now. Well, not that it's impossible that they do solve them, of course. >> > http://tinyurl.com/kmaus >> [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >It's on DPReview now, looks good. Here is the preview: http://www.dpreview.com/articles/sonydslra100/ It looks very good indeed. 10 MP, a much improved Super Steady-Shot which puts Konica Minolta's pathetic Anti-Shake system in its place, plus an Olympus-style dust removal feature. Just wait for all the Konica Minolta enthusiasts who ridiculed the Olympus dust removal system crowing about Sony's "new" feature! The specifications seem remarkably close to those of the Pentax K10D, which will use the same Sony sensor, derived from that in the Nikon D200. Another preview: http://www.dcresource.com/reviews/sony/dslr_a100-review/ >>> > http://tinyurl.com/kmaus >>> [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] >Another preview: >http://www.dcresource.com/reviews/sony/dslr_a100-review/ Oops, forgot to mention the announcement of two Carl Zeiss lenses for the Sony Alpha mount, 85/1.4 and 135/1.8. > Here is the preview: > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > which puts Konica Minolta's pathetic Anti-Shake system in its place, > plus an Olympus-style dust removal feature. What a laugh Polson. 1) The A/S on the K-M is extremely good if not as good as in the lens based IS/VR of Canon/Nikon. IMO, backed up by my record in posting, there is no way that a sensor moving A/S could ever be as good as a lens based system. OTOH, you get it with all lenses (but a couple), so it is a lot more value than IS, esp. if you aleady own a lot of high end lenses. 2) In the past you bashed Sony's entrée into DSLR, so it's odd that you're turning coat here. But not really a surprise at all. > Just wait for all the Konica Minolta enthusiasts who ridiculed the > Olympus dust removal system crowing about Sony's "new" feature! This Minolta user always applauded (on record in various NG's) the Oly system and hoped that K-M or Sony would add it to newer versions. And they have, so I am happy as when removing dust from my 7D sensor it often takes 4 or 5 tries to get a perfectly clean sensor. > The specifications seem remarkably close to those of the Pentax K10D, > which will use the same Sony sensor, derived from that in the Nikon > D200. Another Polson "duh" moment. No reviews will be worthwhile until real photographers have the camera in hand. That leaves Polson out of the equation entirely: http://abpr.railfan.net/abpr.cgi?/september98/09-24-98 see news@polson shots. Cheers, Alan. Signature-- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm -- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin -- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch. > http://tinyurl.com/kmaus Looks like a respectable "new beginning" but nothing impressive. Also uses CF as well as memory stick, so one of my many "wants" has been satisfied. (In fact it is "standard" on CF and MS requires an adaptor). Also has the "anti-dust" vibrator (a la Olympus) that I wished for,(eh, Stacy?) Spec sheet lacks some details (flash sync speed, standard exposure modes (eg: MAS), etc. Does have the "dummy" modes (sigh)). Lacks a second "wheel" rendering manual exposure photography a bit clumsy. Does look like the locks on the exp. mode dial have gone. (Good!!!) Not clear if there is a flash exp comp from the photo or spec. I am not extremely impressed by this so far so I hope they step up to the real deal... but still good to see that my lens investment is protected. Cheers, Alan Signature-- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm -- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin -- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch. |
Reply to this Message |
 Sign In
 Join
 My Latest Posts My Monitored Threads My Blog My Photo Gallery My Profile My Homepage Start New Thread Enable EMail Alerts Rate this Thread
|
©2009 Advenet LLC Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.