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Photo Forum / Digital Photography / DSLR Cameras / March 2006If a 10M DSLR can only take 1GB memory card, what will happen?
Well, the coming Pentax 10M DSLR is a DSLR using SD memory card:- http://dc.watch.impress.co.jp/cda/parts/image_for_link/44665-3308-5-1.html However, common/industrial standard of SD card is bounded at the 1GB ceiling:- http://www.dpreview.com/news/0603/06030902panasonic4gbsdhc.asp .. and there is no standard estabished with SD card higher than 1GB and even the SDHC standard by Panasonic has not yet been finalised but the worse thing is Phil Askey says that the SDHC is NOT compatible with standard SD cameras! Thus, what do you think? (if a 10M DSLR can only take either =<1GB SD card or only to take the coming SDHC card) RiceHigh http://www.geocities.com/ricehigh >> Well, the coming Pentax 10M DSLR is a DSLR using SD memory card:- >> [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] >> RiceHigh >> http://www.geocities.com/ricehigh  SignatureIt's not an issue for most people. The SD cards are considerably faster than the CFC cards and anyone needing some assurance of image safety only uses 1 gig cards anyway. If you limit the card to only 80% full, you can fit all the data from it onto a CD so the seemingly small storage is really not all that much of an issue. I use a 5D and 1 gig cards at 80%. I recently had an assistant dumping the cards to CD via my notebook at a fast moving shoot. I still haven't got an accurate image count but it's in the 4 figure region and I only used 3 CFCs on the job. www.photosbydouglas.com www.weprint2canvas.com If you really must write,use my name at an above domain. It is a solution but it is inconvenient, I think. RiceHigh http://www.geocities.com/ricehigh >Well, the coming Pentax 10M DSLR is a DSLR using SD memory card:- > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > >http://www.dpreview.com/news/0603/06030902panasonic4gbsdhc.asp No it isn't. You can already buy 2GB SD cards, which are reported to work just fine in current SD cameras, and 4GB cards are just appearing. >.. and there is no standard estabished with SD card higher than 1GB and >even the SDHC standard by Panasonic has not yet been finalised but the >worse thing is Phil Askey says that the SDHC is NOT compatible with >standard SD cameras! So what? That doesn't say you can't use an SD card in a SDHC camera; just that you can't go the other way. As long as the camera has a SDHC slot, you'll be able to use SD media or SDHC media. >Thus, what do you think? (if a 10M DSLR can only take either =<1GB SD >card or only to take the coming SDHC card) I think that you're clutching at straws in your anti-Pentax crusade. The 2GB and 4GB SD cards which are currently on market are *not* built according to *any* standard set by the SD Association (as the standard has NOT yet been finalised) and thus these non-standard items will likely have compatibility problem later on with older and newer devices which don't support these "special" SD card. A good example is that some *ist DS user reported that some 2GB card cannot work on the camera with latest firmware. (if interested, do a search at the various forums). My advice is to avoid 2GB and 4GB SD cards which can be purchased now and get these later on when the STANDARDS have been finalised. Anyway, you can buy as many cards as you like and any card you like with your own money. There is none of my business here. RiceHigh http://www.geocities.com/ricehigh > My advice is to avoid 2GB and 4GB SD cards which can be purchased now > and get these later on when the STANDARDS have been finalised. may I know what standard bodies are you involved in? You speak as if you know about standarization process a lot, after all. B. I have already quoted my source of reference, as you should have known, because you have also quoted it. It is what Phil Askey says at the Dpreview news.If you have shown that you have got it, why ask insane and redundant question? I stated my view point based on something which I have also posted here. You speak as if you're becoming very angry just for what I have said for a simple comment as my opinion. RiceHigh http://www.geocities.com/ricehigh > The 2GB and 4GB SD cards which are currently on market are *not* > built [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > RiceHigh > http://www.geocities.com/ricehigh I'm having a bit of rough road with a new San Disk Ultima II 2GB SD card: the camera uses it and shows stored images, but the usual (Belkin) USB 2-fast card reader attached to the usual computer (sony desktop) can't stand it, calls it "unreadable". A HP notebook's built-in reader calls it an empty drive (Please insert a disk into drive O). A three-year-old no-name 6-format Firewire reader attached to the Sony gobbles it up like an old flame. All three readers see all five of the other-size (1GB, 512 MB) SD cards from San Disk and all other mfrs. Mr San Disk seems hesitant to exchange the SD card; I think us San Disk users shouldn't have to shop around for a reader that doesn't discriminate. Actually, I kind of like the idea that some of this electron-ish stuff has a soul. I just don't like to deal with the reality of it. -- Frank ess as if by Magick, it is done > I'm having a bit of rough road with a new San Disk Ultima II > 2GB SD card: the camera uses it and shows stored images, but the usual [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > Actually, I kind of like the idea that some of this electron-ish stuff > has a soul. I just don't like to deal with the reality of it. I have two 2 gig Sandisk ultraII cards for my Rebel XT. I also have a Sandisk reader that reads something like 10 different card types. No problems whatsoever with the 2 gig cards. >> I'm having a bit of rough road with a new San Disk Ultima II >> 2GB SD card: the camera uses it and shows stored images, but the [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > Sandisk reader that reads something like 10 different card types. No > problems whatsoever with the 2 gig cards. Thank you. I've been kind of expecting they will sell me one of their readers... SignatureFrank ess You have no problem with your 2GB cards for your Rebel XT just because they are CF cards, not SD ones! CF card's upper limit is not at 1GB (or maybe atmost 2G *recently*, according to what Phil Askey says). So, everything must be compatible. In contrast, this is not true for SD. RiceHigh http://www.geocities.com/ricehigh > http://www.dpreview.com/news/0603/06030902panasonic4gbsdhc.asp you missed the point that: "There is a catch though, Secure Digital was never designed for capacities over 1 GB, that was solved but then addressing anything over 2 GB became the next problem" thus the actual limit is 2GB. How many Compact Flash cards bigger than 2GB you have? And do you really think that 100-150 (roughly) RAW images on a single card is serious limitation? B. Okay, thanks for the correction. However, there is absolutely no point to conclude that a 2GB card is more than enough for a 10M DSLR. 2G maybe enough for your own current requirements but quite some D200 users have already found that they have often found their card full owing to the large file size of the 10M files. I had my Pentax *ist D 6M DSLR two years ago and I had a 4G card with me for travel and it is still not adequate even I shot in jpeg mode, thus I need to bring one more CF card, that is, two cards with me! I think it's off topic and irrelevant when I talked about the SD card capacity limit and you're talking about the limit is more than adequate afterall.. RiceHigh http://www.geocities.com/ricehigh >I had my Pentax *ist D 6M DSLR two years ago and I had a 4G card with >me for travel and it is still not adequate even I shot in jpeg mode, >thus I need to bring one more CF card, that is, two cards with me! Yup, your excess baggage bills on flights must be crippling! ;-) *Two* CF cards! Woohoo! SignatureKennedy Yes, Socrates himself is particularly missed; A lovely little thinker, but a bugger when he's pissed. Python Philosophers (replace 'nospam' with 'kennedym' when replying) > I had my Pentax *ist D 6M DSLR two years ago and I had a 4G card with > me for travel and it is still not adequate even I shot in jpeg mode, > thus I need to bring one more CF card, that is, two cards with me! Still strikes me as rather than better than film in this regard. It's not like a couple of additional SD cards take up much space or add much weight. --------------- Marc Sabatella marc@outsideshore.com Music, art, & educational materials Featuring "A Jazz Improvisation Primer" http://www.outsideshore.com/ Okay, thanks for the correction. However, there is absolutely no point to conclude that a 2GB card is more than enough for a 10M DSLR. 2G maybe enough for your own current requirements but quite some D200 users have already found that they have often found their card full owing to the large file size of the 10M files. I had my Pentax *ist D 6M DSLR two years ago and I had a 4G card with me for travel and it is still not adequate even I shot in jpeg mode, thus I need to bring one more CF card, that is, two cards with me! I think it's off topic and irrelevant when I talked about the SD card capacity limit and you're talking about the limit is more than adequate afterall.. RiceHigh http://www.geocities.com/ricehigh Okay, thanks for the correction. However, there is absolutely no point to conclude that a 2GB card is more than enough for a 10M DSLR. 2G maybe enough for your own current requirements but quite some D200 users have already found that they have often found their card full owing to the large file size of the 10M files. I had my Pentax *ist D 6M DSLR two years ago and I had a 4G card with me for travel and it is still not adequate even I shot in jpeg mode, thus I need to bring one more CF card, that is, two cards with me! I think it's off topic and irrelevant when I talked about the SD card capacity limit and you're talking about the limit is more than adequate afterall.. RiceHigh http://www.geocities.com/ricehigh Well I don't see the problem. I use 1G cards and while I've been testing the 10M Nikon D200 for DIMi I haven't found the card size a limitation at all. On the D200 I've been getting around 59 RAW (actually NEF but same thing) and this is fine for a single card. Cheers, Wayne Hi all, Just a brief reminder of the multi-image collage and panorama competitions, sponsored by Extensis and RealViz respectively, for March with software prizes. There are no requirements on the software that you can use to do either and no cost to enter: <http://www.dimagemaker.com/competitions.php> There is no reason that either have to look like photographs as the end result and I would love to see some Painter work in both comps to stir people up. More competitions will be added shortly. Cheers, Wayne Wayne J. Cosshall Publisher, The Digital ImageMaker, http://www.dimagemaker.com/ Blog http://www.digitalimagemakerworld.com/ Personal art site http://www.artinyourface.com/ >> http://www.dpreview.com/news/0603/06030902panasonic4gbsdhc.asp > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > B. I have one question about this entire thread. What is the highest number of pictures on a roll of film? 100 to 150 RAW images on a tiny memory card compared to several rolls of film? Personally, I would have several memory cards so all of my pictures are not on the same card in case something goes wrong. > >> http://www.dpreview.com/news/0603/06030902panasonic4gbsdhc.asp > >> [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > I have one question about this entire thread. What is the highest > number of pictures on a roll of film? Somebody, I think Fuji, made 72 exposure rolls of one of their films (with a very thin base). Of course, if you got the special backs, you could run 250 exposure rolls, but few people did. > 100 to 150 RAW images on a tiny memory card compared to several > rolls of film? Personally, I would have several memory cards so all > of my pictures are not on the same card in case something goes > wrong. 100 images to a card means that I could easily need 5 cards for a single day of shooting, if I didn't have time or facilities to offload them onto something else during the day. SignatureDavid Dyer-Bennet, <mailto:dd-b@dd-b.net>, <http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/> RKBA: <http://www.dd-b.net/carry/> Pics: <http://dd-b.lighthunters.net/> <http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/> Dragaera/Steven Brust: <http://dragaera.info/> Yep, so a larger card is always desirable. There is no harm to have a larger card, especially those memory cards are damn cheap now. RiceHigh http://www.geocities.com/ricehigh >Yep, so a larger card is always desirable. There is no harm to have a >larger card, especially those memory cards are damn cheap now. One of the advantages of bigger cards over more smaller cards, which you don't see mentioned very often but seems to be true of all cameras, is that the write speed of the card slows down as it fills up. This can cause problems if you are shooting sequences or even just bracketing. Its usually not worth getting close to filling a card up. SignatureKennedy Yes, Socrates himself is particularly missed; A lovely little thinker, but a bugger when he's pissed. Python Philosophers (replace 'nospam' with 'kennedym' when replying) Interesting read, thanks for the info. And yes, this is the first time I got known to this issue, too. RiceHigh http://www.geocities.com/ricehigh Maybe I'm just being obtuse (and I'm sorry for that), but what's the big deal? Technology has limitations. You identify those limitations and you see if you can work within them. If you can't, you find the option that works for you. If you can't afford that option, you make a compromise, somewhere. If you want an 84 degree angle of view and a 1.4 aperture, you need to be using a Canon full frame camera and the 24mm 1.4L prime. That's just a limitation of what's available right now, from Canon and everyone else. Can't afford those cameras or that lens? Then you either get a slower lens (plenty available for cropped frame sizes) or a slightly longer lens with a narrower angle of view. Likewise, if you want to shoot more pictures per card, you need to buy a camera that uses CF. If you don't want to do that then you decide to compromise and simply buy more cards. The price incentive for higher capacity cards isn't very strong in SD and it doesn't exist in CF (2 1GB CF cards are cheaper than a 2GB; 2 2GB cards are cheaper than a 4GB). Having pictures spread over more cards is good security in case a card fails (it happens, however rarely). Changing cards is done quickly and SD cards are so small and light you don't even realize you're carrying them. You've identified a limitation. Good. Now, aware of it, you can decide how best you need to deal with it. But it exists and there's nothing to be done. If it's really a problem, you're looking into the wrong camera. If it isn't really a problem, then why get so worked up? The limitation is possible but has not yet been identified, since we have only seen the camera's prototype under the window at the PMA. Now, everything can be improved and new technology and standards can be used to improve it before it will be put into the market. BTW, I see your point, I think there will be a better camera anyway, before some days it's really the "wrong camera" with a "limitation" which every Pentaxian who want to get this upgrade body will not wish to see. RiceHigh http://www.geocities.com/ricehigh "RiceHigh" <ricehigh@yahoo.com> wrote in news:1143187878.323680.275170 @g10g2000cwb.googlegroups.com: > The limitation is possible but has not yet been identified, since we > have only seen the camera's prototype under the window at the PMA. Now, [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > RiceHigh > http://www.geocities.com/ricehigh The new Pentax will surely have some limitations, but with the prices for SD cards today, I don't see SD cards as a big limitation. I am more concerned about focus speed in low light and battery life time. But we have to wait 10 months to see what world we are living in then. Stig Vidar Hovland |
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