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Photo Forum / Digital Photography / DSLR Cameras / December 2005

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UV Filter vs. Skylight

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Rainbow Girl Sue - 26 Dec 2005 21:15 GMT
I was going to buy a filter to protect my lens & was wondering whether I
should get a UV/Haze Filter or a Skylight 1-A. They look very similar. Are
there any advantages of one or the other? Any info would be appreciated.
Thanks in advance.

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Randall Ainsworth - 26 Dec 2005 21:48 GMT
> I was going to buy a filter to protect my lens & was wondering whether I
> should get a UV/Haze Filter or a Skylight 1-A. They look very similar. Are
> there any advantages of one or the other? Any info would be appreciated.

You need neither.
Basic Wedge - 26 Dec 2005 22:17 GMT
Precisely what must you protect your lens from? Neither filter will stop a
bullet.

Rob

---------------------------------------

>I was going to buy a filter to protect my lens & was wondering whether I
> should get a UV/Haze Filter or a Skylight 1-A. They look very similar. Are
> there any advantages of one or the other? Any info would be appreciated.
Bill - 26 Dec 2005 22:48 GMT
>I was going to buy a filter to protect my lens & was wondering whether I
>should get a UV/Haze Filter or a Skylight 1-A. They look very similar. Are
>there any advantages of one or the other? Any info would be appreciated.

While I personally don't recommend a filter to "protect" your front
lense element unless you're a clumsy person, if you feel you must have a
filter, then I suggest you get a UV filter. A skylight filter adds a
slight warming to your images, which you usually want to avoid under
many circumstances. A skylight filter may be wanted when shooting on a
sunny day in the snow or on a beach.

And if you do get a protective filter, buy something that is "optically
transparent" and well coated, like a Hoya or B&W. Sure they cost more,
but they shouldn't reduce image quality.

For me, filters are just more glass in the way of the sensor. I prefer
to use specialized filters only when needed for specific purposes, and
let the lense hood keep the front element safe.
JPS@no.komm - 26 Dec 2005 23:04 GMT
>A skylight filter adds a
>slight warming to your images, which you usually want to avoid under
>many circumstances.

I'm not advocating ewither, but the slight difference in whiteness is
moot with digital, unless you are using a fixed WB preset.  A filter
that is slightly red will actually bring the mnatural WB of most
digitals a little closer to white, anyway, as they tend to capture
everything greenish-cyan at the RAW level.
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nick c - 27 Dec 2005 03:37 GMT
> I was going to buy a filter to protect my lens & was wondering whether I
> should get a UV/Haze Filter or a Skylight 1-A. They look very similar. Are
> there any advantages of one or the other? Any info would be appreciated.
> Thanks in advance.

If you're into beach scenes go for the 1A perhaps even a 1B. If you're
into general scenics go for the UV. If you're into street shooting or
indoor shooting, you don't need either one. One of the best ways to
protect your lens is to use a lens hood .... all the time.
Wolfgang Weisselberg - 27 Dec 2005 18:25 GMT
> I was going to buy a filter to protect my lens

A lens cap is much more sturdy.

> & was wondering whether I
> should get a UV/Haze Filter or a Skylight 1-A.

There are also protection filters which are completely
neutral, optically.  Buy a high quality coated one.

-Wolfgang
Fred McKenzie - 27 Dec 2005 19:44 GMT
> I was going to buy a filter to protect my lens & was wondering whether I
> should get a UV/Haze Filter or a Skylight 1-A. They look very similar. Are
> there any advantages of one or the other? Any info would be appreciated.

Sue-

The need for such protection is often suggested by dealers who want to
scare you into spending more money.  Neither UV, Haze nor Skylight will
hurt your lens, so it doesn't need to be protected from them.

The use of a filter will degrade your images slightly.  If you happen to
be using the cheap kit lens that comes with Canon, go ahead.  You won't be
able to tell the difference!

Fred
Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark) - 27 Dec 2005 21:08 GMT
>>I was going to buy a filter to protect my lens & was wondering whether I
>>should get a UV/Haze Filter or a Skylight 1-A. They look very similar. Are
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
>
> Fred

I strongly disagree that 1) that it's the dealer who wants to scare you,
and 2) that there is any image degradation, at least with
reasonable quality filters.

I use Hoya super coated UV filters on my lenses.  I used to
use tiffen.  I have never seen an issue with degradation of
image quality, except for the following:  Some 35mm lenses
have a pretty flat front element.  This can result in a reflection
between the front lens element and the filter (any filter).
I have found reflections in images with highly transmitting filters.
(I have not seen the problem with circular polarizers).
The Hoya super coated filters do not have this problem, and their
optical quality is high.

The advantage of a filter is that it protects the front lens element.
For example, when you work outdoors you will get dust on the optical
surface then humidity/water spray/rain moistens the dust and
glues it to the optical surface.   Water and/or humidity
partially dissolves the minerals/chemicals in the dust, which
if not completely removed, will later precipitate onto the
optical surface as the surface dries, cementing the dust particle
to the surface.  You can clean it carefully, but over
time the optical surface and coatings degrade.  One can simply
throw away the filter an put on a new one when you get to that
point.  High humidity environments will do the same.

Examples: Hiking in the mountains: dust gets on the camera, you
approach a waterfall and spray wets the dust.  Ocean spray
of salt water is very damaging.  Snowy day: snow wets the lens,
gluing the dust down. etc.

If all your work is in a clean room, you don't need a filter.

While a lens hood protects against some of the dirt problems,
wide angle lenses are more of a problem because the hood
can't provide a tight opening.  My 500 f/4 L IS lens has a great
hood and does a very good job of protecting against dust,
and I do not use a filter on it (they are not made that big).

For my smaller lenses, I use step up rings to bring most lenses
to a common size.  That way I only need a couple of filter sizes.
For example, my largest lens (excluding the 500 mm) uses 77 mm filters.
But most of my lenses use 72 and smaller filters.  So I bought step-up
rings to bring those lenses to 72 mm.  I use 72 and 77 Hoya super
coated filters on my lenses and with digital I only carry 72 and 77
mm circular polarizers.  On my large format system, I also use
72 mm filters, and use Hoya super coated UV filters on them and carry
72 mm circular polarizers and 81A and 81B filters.

Roger
Photos at: http://www.clarkvision.com
Alan Browne - 28 Dec 2005 00:58 GMT
> I was going to buy a filter to protect my lens & was wondering whether I
> should get a UV/Haze Filter or a Skylight 1-A. They look very similar. Are
> there any advantages of one or the other? Any info would be appreciated.
> Thanks in advance.

I only use filters for protection on my 28-70, 20mm and 300mm f/2.8 as
they have a large front area and little 'depth' of lensshade to protect
the front element.  At that, once shooting I often remove the filter
unless there's a lot of rain/mist/dust/children's fingers/ etc.

If you insist, then the UV.  Or the Skylight if you're above 5000 ft ASL
most of the time.

Cheers,
Alan

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Matt Clara - 29 Dec 2005 15:19 GMT
> > I was going to buy a filter to protect my lens & was wondering whether I
> > should get a UV/Haze Filter or a Skylight 1-A. They look very similar. Are
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> Cheers,
> Alan

Don't you have that backwards?  The UV becomes effective at altitude, the
skylight just adds a little red to counteract the blue of the sky for photos
in open shade, etc.

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Matt Clara
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Alan Browne - 30 Dec 2005 20:35 GMT
>>If you insist, then the UV.  Or the Skylight if you're above 5000 ft ASL
>>most of the time.
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> skylight just adds a little red to counteract the blue of the sky for photos
> in open shade, etc.

You're right that UV increases with altitude.  But the UV effect on
digital is all but meaningless unless at very high altitude (>10K feet).

High altitude also means greater blue, colder image, which the skylight
'warms' up a little for non shade images.

Open shade (shade under blue sky) should be shot with an 81A or B filter
to bring it back to neutral.  RAW import is the new shorthand for this
of course, no filter really needed at all.  But since I have a B+W 81A
I'll use it, damnit!

UV is effective at reducing the effect of haze which we see most often
at sea level.  In that, it's useful as nothing in RAW import will fix that.

Cheers,
Alan

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zeitgeist - 30 Dec 2005 22:41 GMT
> I was going to buy a filter to protect my lens & was wondering whether I
> should get a UV/Haze Filter or a Skylight 1-A. They look very similar. Are
> there any advantages of one or the other? Any info would be appreciated.
> Thanks in advance.

skylight filters were to warm the image up a bit incase there was a bluish
cast from the blue sky.  They are totally irrelevent to digital photography,
the only folks who benefited from them were the slide shooters who needed to
get it right on the film, those who shot negs did little but waste 5 or 10%
of their film speed, and digital shooters need only white balance or correct
in photoshop.

This was always a debate in portrait lists.  If you shot a couple rolls, one
with and one without a warming filter you would most likely not see a bit of
difference, the pro labs would automatically adjust the color balance.   All
you did was soften the image from the extra glass and loose a bit of
exposure, it was one of the reasons most photogs would shoot their ISO 160
film at 100.

this reply is echoed to the z-prophoto mailing list at yahoogroups.com
Alan Browne - 31 Dec 2005 17:46 GMT
> This was always a debate in portrait lists.  If you shot a couple rolls, one
> with and one without a warming filter you would most likely not see a bit of
> difference, the pro labs would automatically adjust the color balance.   All
> you did was soften the image from the extra glass and loose a bit of
> exposure, it was one of the reasons most photogs would shoot their ISO 160
> film at 100.

The light loss from a skylight/UV filter is much less than 1/3 stop,
never mind 2/3.  The main reason portrait 160 is shot at 100 is that it
brings out detail in the dark areas, esp. dark hair and clothing, in the
image while not blowing out the highlights.  Color negative film has
lots of latitude for overexposure.

IAC, in TTL exposure the presence of a filter is, er, transparent,
regardless of the filter light loss.

I shoot 160NC @ 100 without any filter all the time.  When I forget to
add a filter it's the 81A under open shade.  Thankfully the lab can
correct that, and so can RAW import.

Cheers,
Alan

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