EOS20D image sharpness

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Red Sheraton - 16 Jan 2005 14:24 GMT

I've heard a few reports about the images produced by the 20D being a
little soft. Can this be corrected by sharpening in Photoshop (I use
version 7)? If I've taken several hundred of images on a 20D can I
sharpen them quickly in batch mode? And finally will I only notice lack
any lack of sharpness on A4 prints or larger?

Any other information I (and other potential 20D buyers) should know on
this subject regarding the 20D?

For the record I currently have a Powershot G5, but need to upgrade to
a DSLR, preferably sticking with Canon as I already have a EOS30,
dedicated flash and three Canon lenses.

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mc - 16 Jan 2005 15:59 GMT

> I've heard a few reports about the images produced by the 20D being a
> little soft. Can this be corrected by sharpening in Photoshop (I use
> version 7)? If I've taken several hundred of images on a 20D can I
> sharpen them quickly in batch mode? And finally will I only notice lack
> any lack of sharpness on A4 prints or larger?

Or just turn up the sharpening that is done by the CPU in the camera; it's a
menu setting.

In general, professionally oriented cameras, by default, do less sharpening
than point-and-shoots; this reflects the idea that you're probably going to
want to have more control of it yourself. But you can adjust it to what you
like.

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Lester Wareham - 16 Jan 2005 16:32 GMT

It is early days for me with the 20D but the sharpness and contrast is good.

I am sure a 1Ds MkII is even better but I don't have the wallet or arm
strength for that.

The 18-55mm is OK for A4, the 100mm Macro is much better.

I expect shaper lens will improve things further, but I have to replace all
my FD glass.

Before I committed to a purchase I printed a review image at A3 to see how I
liked it. My conclusion is it was at least as good as scanned film but with
very low grain (noise).

Take a look at http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canoneos20d/page29.asp

Lester

> I've heard a few reports about the images produced by the 20D being a
> little soft. Can this be corrected by sharpening in Photoshop (I use
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> a DSLR, preferably sticking with Canon as I already have a EOS30,
> dedicated flash and three Canon lenses.

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Red Sheraton - 16 Jan 2005 21:32 GMT

Any other opinions, please?

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Charles Schuler - 16 Jan 2005 23:01 GMT

> Any other opinions, please?

I pretty much agree with what has been posted and will add that Canon uses a
fairly aggressive antialias filter in their SLRs to avoid Moir? pattern
distortions. Nikon seems to use a less aggressive filter in theirs. Thus,
Canon shots are not quite as sharp and Nikon shots can show some Moir?
pattern distortion.

Postprocessing can make the Canon shots sharper and it seems that many folks
use some degree of sharpening.

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JPS@no.komm - 17 Jan 2005 19:58 GMT

>> Any other opinions, please?
>
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>Postprocessing can make the Canon shots sharper and it seems that many folks
>use some degree of sharpening.

Generally true, but the 20D has a weaker AA filter than the 10D. There
is absolutely nothing about 20D capture at the sensor level that is less
sharp than its predecessors; quite the contrary. The pixels are closer
together *AND* they have about 50% higher pixel-to-pixel contrast.

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JPS@no.komm - 17 Jan 2005 20:39 GMT

>Generally true, but the 20D has a weaker AA filter than the 10D. There
>is absolutely nothing about 20D capture at the sensor level that is less
>sharp than its predecessors; quite the contrary. The pixels are closer
>together *AND* they have about 50% higher pixel-to-pixel contrast.

I should have said "potential" pixel-to-pixel contrast, as this is
totally dependent on the optics and a lack of motion-blur.

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andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid - 28 Jan 2005 17:44 GMT

>> Any other opinions, please?

> I pretty much agree with what has been posted and will add that Canon uses a
> fairly aggressive antialias filter in their SLRs to avoid Moiré pattern
> distortions. Nikon seems to use a less aggressive filter in theirs.

That's not true in general, just of the Nikon D70. The D100 has a
pretty good antialias filter.

Andrew.

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One Million Pics - 17 Jan 2005 10:54 GMT

> Any other opinions, please?

The 20D with standard 17~55 'kit lens' can produce ultra sharp images.
Canon recommend Photoshop's unsharp mask at 300% with a 0.3 pixel radius
to counter the effects of their anti alias filter.

You could also use a dedicated program like ultra sharpen or many others
if you choose. The images here: http://www.tecphoto.com.au/examples.htm
were shot at 1600 ISO with a Canon 20D and the 17~55 Kit lens. The above
(Canon) recommended sharpening was applied after it was resized. I also
removed the digital noise of ISO 1600 before resizing.

If image sharpness is the criteria of your purchase, buy one. They have
a few reported problems. My Dad has his fair share of them with his but
mine has not missed a shot in 3 months. I think of all the problems
reported for these cameras 98% are from people who never bothered to
understand the settings and their implication.

Standard default settings will not produce great pictures. I had to live
with mine for several weeks before I got as familiar with it as I was
with a D70 Nikon. I wouldn't ever go back to a Nikon, incidently.

Kiah

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Skip M - 17 Jan 2005 04:33 GMT

Sharp? Ya want sharp? How about this:
http://www.shutterspeedway.com/cgi-bin/gallery.cgi?user=SkipM&gallery=My%2020D%2
0images/Model%20Cars&picture=3
or this:
http://www.shutterspeedway.com/cgi-bin/gallery.cgi?user=SkipM&gallery=My%2020D%2
0images/Model%20Cars&picture=8
(1/18 model cars)
or this:
http://www.shutterspeedway.com/cgi-bin/gallery.cgi?user=SkipM&gallery=My%2020D%2
0images/Day%20at%20the%20Races&picture=17
full size Bugatti.

First two were shot with the Tamron 90mm f2.8 Macro lens, the last with the
Canon 28-135 f4-5.6 IS USM lens.
All with a minimal amount of unsharp mask added in Pshop.

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Skip Middleton
http://www.shadowcatcherimagery.com

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JPS@no.komm - 17 Jan 2005 20:01 GMT

>All with a minimal amount of unsharp mask added in Pshop.

I found myself using 300% or more at 0.3px with my 10D; with the 20D,
150% is plenty (for viewing at 100% on the monitor).

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JPS@no.komm - 17 Jan 2005 19:52 GMT

>I've heard a few reports about the images produced by the 20D being a
>little soft.

You have heard nonsense. The 20D is the sharpest Canon DSLR to date.
It has the smallest spacing between pixels, allowing it to resolve a
given lens better than any other Canon DSLR (and most by other
companies, as well, except perhaps the new 12 MP Nikon). It also has
the least aggressive anti-aliasing filter, allowing full transition from
white to black in 2 pixels (exclusive), as compared to three in the 10D.

The 20D is also the newest affordable DSLR made by canon, and one of the
best selling of all brands, and many pictures available from it are from
new users with green photography skills. The higher resolution of the
sensor means that with a lens that is the limiting factor on a 10D, the
20D image will look less sharp when the pixels from both are viewed at
the same size. This means that the lens or technique is not sharp; it
is not the camera's doing. A camera can only work with what is fed to
it by the lens.

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