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Photo Forum / Digital Photography / DSLR Cameras / August 2005Are flashes "cash cows" for the camera makers?
Most of them look and feel like they cost about $20 to produce. Except for some really elaborate units. Why is it a flash for a $1000 camera/lens costs $300 or more? All it is is some control electronics, and a flash tube, neither of which cost much. At least lenses have some valuable components in them, the glass elements and the machined parts. -Rich > Most of them look and feel like they cost about $20 to produce. > Except for some really elaborate units. Why is it a flash for > a $1000 camera/lens costs $300 or more? > -Rich Simple, supply vs demand If there was a profit to be made by selling them cheaper then someone would be doing it. Toa >> Most of them look and feel like they cost about $20 to produce. >> Except for some really elaborate units. Why is it a flash for [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > >Toa There are some aftermarket flash makers, they either tend to be pretty cheap (Vivitar) (and I don't know how they stack up to the name brands) or as expensive (Metz) as the name brands. -Rich "Bittorrents are REFUNDS for all the BAD movie products Hollywood never gave us refunds for in the past" Official units like Canon 580ex units are obviously priced to sell to people who want the 'one make' aura. One might ask how come Canon sell their equivalent lenses for twice what the offbrands use... is Canon glass twice as good as the offbrands? T. > Official units like Canon 580ex units are obviously priced to sell to > people who want the 'one make' aura. Probably right to a certain extent. > One might ask how come Canon sell their equivalent lenses for twice > what the offbrands use... is Canon glass twice as good as the > offbrands? If that offbrand is Sigma or Quantaray... >> Most of them look and feel like they cost about $20 to produce. >> Except for some really elaborate units. Why is it a flash for [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > Toa Someone is doing it and I just received mine. (Sunpak MZ-440AF F/EOS) I looked at the Sunpak website and thought it would work will with my 350D as it was advertised to be made for Canon eTTL etc..... Didn't work. In fact, the thing worked as well as the $12.95 Phoenix flash I had purchased a month ago, which was actually advertised as a manual flash. It really sucks being a newbie at digital SLR's and having to find this out the hard way. Everything I read about flashes for the DSLR Canon products said; "Buy the 580EX". Well, I can't afford it, don't even need all the mega-controllability, and think the darn thing is way overpriced as it is. I ordered a 420EX. I just hope I don't find out that this flash is an overpriced POS. I just want to get some quality images of my grandchildren....... T.W. > Someone is doing it and I just received mine. (Sunpak MZ-440AF F/EOS) > T.W. You misread/misunderstood what I wrote. The question was why are they so expensive when they look to be so cheap to produce. My answer to that is supply vs demand. If they could be sold cheaper then they would be That should not be taken to mean that there's no other cheaper options out there as I know there are. But they're not the same Toa >> If there was a profit to be made by selling them cheaper then >> someone would be doing it. > Someone is doing it and I just received mine. (Sunpak MZ-440AF > F/EOS) I looked at the Sunpak website and thought it would work will > with my 350D as it was advertised to be made for Canon eTTL etc..... Where did you see that the Sunpak Sunpak MZ-440AF F/EOS, was made for Canon E-TTL? The spec. sheet I've got on this flash only says TTL - which is something different. (It is made for, and will work fine with, some older /film/ Canon EOS bodies.) > Didn't work. In fact, the thing worked as well as the $12.95 Phoenix > flash I had purchased a month ago, which was actually advertised as > a manual flash. Either somebody lied to you, or you misread the specifications. Either way, you shouldn't blame Sunpak for that (unless, of course, they are the company that lied.) > It really sucks being a newbie at digital SLR's and having to find > this out the hard way. Agreed. But I don't think this would have happened if you've checked out the specifications properly before buying. There exists a number of inexpensive third party flashes that will automatically give you the correct exposure with the 350D. Most are auto flashes, but there is also some with with full E-TTL II support. One of them is the Sunpak PZ40X for Canon - which is about $20 dollars more than the incompatible flash you bought. I.e. $99.95 @ B&H that is a lot less than the canon 420EX. Btw. I maintain a list of third party flashes that supports E-TTL and E-TTL here with Canon DSLR bodies here: http://folk.uio.no/gisle/photo/flash.html > Everything I read about flashes for the DSLR Canon products said; > "Buy the 580EX". Well, then you've obviously not read my webpage yet :-) . > Well, I can't afford it, don't even need all the mega-control- > lability, and think the darn thing is way overpriced as it is. > I ordered a 420EX. I just hope I don't find out that this flash > is an overpriced POS. It is not S - but it is a lot more expensive than it should be, and also more expensive than similiar (or better!) flashes made by third parties. > I just want to get some quality images of my grandchildren....... In that case, get a brand new (to make sure the trigger voltage is OK) auto flash such as Vivitar 285 ($84.95 @ B&H). Auto gives just as reliable exposure control than E-TTL II, is much easier to control (to dial in flash comp. just "lie" about your aperture). The Vivitar even packs more power that the Canon 420EX - which will come handy when you want to use bounce to soften the shadows.  Signature- gisle hannemyr [ gisle{at}hannemyr.no - http://folk.uio.no/gisle/ ] ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Kodak DCS460, Canon Powershot G5, Olympus 2020Z ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> If there was a profit to be made by selling them cheaper then >> someone would be doing it. > Someone is doing it and I just received mine. (Sunpak MZ-440AF > F/EOS) I looked at the Sunpak website and thought it would work will > with my 350D as it was advertised to be made for Canon eTTL etc..... Where on Sunpak's website did you see that the Sunpak Sunpak MZ-440AF F/EOS, was made for Canon E-TTL? When I look on their site (i.e. www.tocad.com/flash/mz440.html, which is redirected from www.sunpak.com) it says "Auto TTL flash functions for Nikon, Canon, Minolta and Pentax camera systems". No mention of E-TTL (or eTTL). TTL is something different than E-TTL. This flash is is made for (and will work just fine with) older /film/ Canon EOS bodies. > Didn't work. In fact, the thing worked as well as the $12.95 Phoenix > flash I had purchased a month ago, which was actually advertised as > a manual flash. You misread the specifications. You shouldn't blame Sunpak for that. > It really sucks being a newbie at digital SLR's and having to find > this out the hard way. Agreed. But I don't think this would have happened if you've read the specifications properly before buying. There exists a number of inexpensive third party flashes that will automatically give you the correct exposure with the 350D. Most are auto flashes, but there is also some with with full E-TTL II support. One of them is the Sunpak PZ40X for Canon - which is about $20 dollars more than the incompatible flash you bought. I.e. $99.95 @ B&H that is a lot less than the canon 420EX. Btw. I maintain a list of third party flashes that supports E-TTL and E-TTL here with Canon DSLR bodies here: http://folk.uio.no/gisle/photo/flash.html > Everything I read about flashes for the DSLR Canon products said; > "Buy the 580EX". Well, then you've obviously not read my webpage yet :-) . > Well, I can't afford it, don't even need all the mega-control- > lability, and think the darn thing is way overpriced as it is. > I ordered a 420EX. I just hope I don't find out that this flash > is an overpriced POS. It is not a POS - but it is a lot more expensive than it should be, and also more expensive than similiar (or better!) flashes made by third parties. > I just want to get some quality images of my grandchildren....... In that case, get a brand new (to make sure the trigger voltage is OK) plain auto flash such as Vivitar 285 ($84.95 @ B&H). Auto gives just as reliable exposure control than E-TTL II, is much easier to control (to dial in flash comp. just "lie" about your aperture). The Vivitar even packs more power that the Canon 420EX - which will come handy when you want to use bounce to soften the shadows. Signature- gisle hannemyr [ gisle{at}hannemyr.no - http://folk.uio.no/gisle/ ] ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Kodak DCS460, Canon Powershot G5, Olympus 2020Z ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > POS. I just want to get some quality images of my grandchildren....... Sit them near a window on a light clouded day. No flash. Reflector board on opposite side. Make photography. Signature-- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm -- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin -- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch. > Most of them look and feel like they cost about $20 to produce. > Except for some really elaborate units. Why is it a flash for > a $1000 camera/lens costs $300 or more? All it is is some control > electronics, and a flash tube, neither of which cost much. At least > lenses have some valuable components in them, the glass elements and > the machined parts. For a change, I have to agree with you. But then, the last place I want to have a flash is in the hot shoe. > > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >to have a flash is in the hot shoe. > You should try living in the UK. We have always been ripped off here. Prices in the US roughly translate to one dollar to the UK pound. We are already taxed up the eyballs here... Andy. Some are, some aren't. And it's a level of degree as well. Pentax and Nikon, iirc, have their flashes made by Sunpak. But anyone who pays MSRP deserves it. Collin KC8TKA > Most of them look and feel like they cost about $20 to produce. > Except for some really elaborate units. Why is it a flash for > a $1000 camera/lens costs $300 or more? All it is is some control > electronics, and a flash tube, neither of which cost much. At least > lenses have some valuable components in them, the glass elements and > the machined parts. Not much volume coupled with the "glamour" of the big flash. If you look at a broad basket of flashes for studio work (very low volume), the price is about $0.90 to $1.50 per W-s. (USD). A GN 50 flash is about 125 W/s, so at worst should cost ~$200 using the comparison above. As there are a lot more accessory flashes sold than studio (mono or pack) flashes, they should cost less per W-s or at least hold even. Of course, a camera flash such as a Minolta 5600HS or Canon EX580 is individually much more complex and capable (functionality) than a monolight or pack light system, so that does add to the cost ... but not nearly as much as the pricing suggests. I doubt there are many machined parts. Some stamped metal guides and otherwise moulded parts is about as high as it gets. MO. Cheers, Alan Signature-- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm -- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin -- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch. |
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