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Photo Forum / Digital Photography / DSLR Cameras / August 2005The DSLR alternative??
Now Kodak has jumped on the bandwagon. First Samsung, then Panasonic, then Fuji and now Kodak. Megapixels, long zooms, lots of manual control. I wonder how this segment is going to sell? http://www.dpreview.com/news/0508/05080202kodak_p880p850.asp > Now Kodak has jumped on the bandwagon. First Samsung, then > Panasonic, then Fuji and now Kodak. > Megapixels, long zooms, lots of manual control. > I wonder how this segment is going to sell? > http://www.dpreview.com/news/0508/05080202kodak_p880p850.asp Funny looking viewfinder bump on the top. Why bother when it's not going to match the actual framing anyways?  SignaturePaul Furman http://www.edgehill.net/1 san francisco native plants >> Now Kodak has jumped on the bandwagon. First Samsung, then >> Panasonic, then Fuji and now Kodak. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Funny looking viewfinder bump on the top. Why bother when it's not > going to match the actual framing anyways? It supposedly has an electronic viewfinder, which should provide a 100% accurate representation. But what is that lump on top? David > Now Kodak has jumped on the bandwagon. First Samsung, then > Panasonic, then Fuji and now Kodak. > Megapixels, long zooms, lots of manual control. > I wonder how this segment is going to sell? > http://www.dpreview.com/news/0508/05080202kodak_p880p850.asp They're starting to creep up on small DSLR size, too. I couldn't find the size of the sensor on the P880, but it is close to the size of a 350D, albeit 1/2 the weight when the latter has a 17-85 IS mounted. I wonder about the price... SignatureSkip Middleton http://www.shadowcatcherimagery.com >>Now Kodak has jumped on the bandwagon. First Samsung, then >>Panasonic, then Fuji and now Kodak. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > albeit 1/2 the weight when the latter has a 17-85 IS mounted. I wonder > about the price... A clue to the sensor size is the minimum aperture of f8. That indicates to me that it is a small sensor. >>>Now Kodak has jumped on the bandwagon. First Samsung, then >>>Panasonic, then Fuji and now Kodak. [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > A clue to the sensor size is the minimum aperture of f8. That indicates > to me that it is a small sensor. Oh, I knew it was small, I was looking for the exact dimensions. You're right, f2.8-8 range is a clue to the lack of size, esp. when compared to the f4-32 of the 17-85 or f2.8-22 of the 24-70 L. As I re-read my post, I can see my wording could lead to confusion, I meant the camera was close to 350D size, not the sensor. SignatureSkip Middleton http://www.shadowcatcherimagery.com >>>>Now Kodak has jumped on the bandwagon. First Samsung, then >>>>Panasonic, then Fuji and now Kodak. [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > As I re-read my post, I can see my wording could lead to confusion, I meant > the camera was close to 350D size, not the sensor. Yes. I misread your post, misread the DPReview aricle, and until I noticed the f8 limit, I thought the Kodak Camera was interesting. I expect it probably isn't. I think cameras like these are probably overestimated, and comparatively cheap P&S zooms often underestimated. i think what appears to be the viewfinder above the lens must be the af sensor and illuminator. i wonder how much of a nuisance f/8 minimum would be. both the p880 and p850 looked good to me as well until this was pointed out. > Now Kodak has jumped on the bandwagon. First Samsung, then > Panasonic, then Fuji and now Kodak. > Megapixels, long zooms, lots of manual control. > I wonder how this segment is going to sell? > http://www.dpreview.com/news/0508/05080202kodak_p880p850.asp Is RichA coming from the stone age? These types of cameras have been around for years. people always want more MP and more zoom. Only better educated people also want bigger sensor and image stabilization and want better quality lenses. And please define what is "lots of manual control"? I am not aware of any cameras other than slim and small type without suficient manual controls. As for how well will they sell. I would say they will do well if the price is kept below $400-$500. Many people don't know the fine art of photography equipment and the speficiation sells. At the time when I had Olympus C-3000Z, 3MP P&S cameras, I would be sold by this type of cameras. But after having a Rebel/20D and seeing the amazing picture quality I could archieve (with appropiate lenses, of course). I cannot go back to a simple P&S. Plus knowing the high MP compromises the low light performance make these type of cameras a big no, no for me. >> Now Kodak has jumped on the bandwagon. First Samsung, then >> Panasonic, then Fuji and now Kodak. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >more MP and more zoom. Only better educated people also want bigger >sensor and image stabilization and want better quality lenses. Oh they did exist, for sure. Olympus lead the way, they had P&S with long zooms and even fixed lens DSLRs with long zooms. But they ditched most of them. Now, more and more companies are featuring them as their flagship cameras instead of venturing into the DSLR world. >And please define what is "lots of manual control"? I am not aware of >any cameras other than slim and small type without suficient manual >controls. More than whatever else they previously offered. Take a look at Samsung's current crop and then the new 815 coming. >As for how well will they sell. I would say they will do well if the >price is kept below $400-$500. Many people don't know the fine art of >photography equipment and the speficiation sells. True. >At the time when I had Olympus C-3000Z, 3MP P&S cameras, I would be sold >by this type of cameras. But after having a Rebel/20D and seeing the >amazing picture quality I could archieve (with appropiate lenses, of >course). I cannot go back to a simple P&S. The refrain I'm hearing that will probably be used to sell them against cheap DSLRs is "NO DUST!" >Plus knowing the high MP compromises the low light performance make >these type of cameras a big no, no for me. I think more than a few people exaggerate their need for "low light" capabilities, as a way of justifying lugging around a DSLR with all the lenses, etc. But it would be nice to have it when needed. -Rich > Oh they did exist, for sure. Olympus lead the way, they had P&S with > long zooms and even fixed lens DSLRs with long zooms. But they > ditched most of them. Now, more and more companies are featuring them > as their flagship cameras instead of venturing into the DSLR world. Sony makes those high end digicam too. Sony is joining forces with K-M to make dSLR. Panasonic is in the 4/3 camp and considering they also make professional grade video cameras, they have enough name recognition to venture into professional still cameras too. You don't need to be reminded about Fujifilm, Pentax and Olympus, do you? As for Kodak, the name just doesn't fly in high end cameras. They are now concentrated in sensor manufacturing. Perhaps they might return to the 4/3 format someday. > More than whatever else they previously offered. Take a look at > Samsung's current crop and then the new 815 coming. Perhaps you can do the research for me telling me what exciting manual controls that only this new camera have. > The refrain I'm hearing that will probably be used to sell them > against cheap DSLRs is "NO DUST!" Maybe. I have not cleaned the sensor since I got it last December. I have taken thousands of pictures and changed lenses hundreds of times. > I think more than a few people exaggerate their need for "low light" > capabilities, as a way of justifying lugging around a DSLR with all > the lenses, etc. But it would be nice to have it when needed. > -Rich Your last sentence is correct. The basic premise is use the right tool at the right time. I am glad I have both Canon 20D & Sony V1. Only people like you who bought a high end P&S have to spend that much time to find excuses to justify your purchasing decision. >Maybe. I have not cleaned the sensor since I got it last December. I >have taken thousands of pictures and changed lenses hundreds of times. The only time I see dust is when I accidentally leave the camera set to a slow shutter-priority and a high ISO, and aim at the sky. If you rarely use f/16 and smaller, you will rarely see dust. Still, an anti-dust feature in my next body would be welcome. Signature<>>< ><<> ><<> <>>< ><<> <>>< <>>< ><<> John P Sheehy <JPS@no.komm> ><<> <>>< <>>< ><<> <>>< ><<> ><<> <>>< >Plus knowing the high MP compromises the low light performance make >these type of cameras a big no, no for me. It would be nice if technology was developed that could bin sensels during readout, in a lower-MP mode for low light. Once readout has occured, binning digitally is not quite the same thing. You'd really need to drain 4 or 9 sensels at a time. An adequate AA filter should prevent "box filter" artifacts. Signature<>>< ><<> ><<> <>>< ><<> <>>< <>>< ><<> John P Sheehy <JPS@no.komm> ><<> <>>< <>>< ><<> <>>< ><<> ><<> <>>< |
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