Bug in Dynax 7D firmware

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Stéphane Guillard - 01 Jul 2005 18:18 GMT

Hi,

I've finally found something bad with my 7D :)

I have set the picture storage mode to large jpegs, one file folder per day.

Last week end I was shooting a couple of pictures, when the memory card got
full (a 256 MB compactflash).

I deleted a few pictures from previous days.

Then I could shoot another couple of pictures, but at one point when I
wanted to review the pictures, the camera displayed something in the lines
of "memory card unusable - format ?"

I shut the camera off, then on, I can review the pictures from all days but
the last.

Repeat : same.

When i hooked the camera to the PC (USB connection, simple "remote drive"
mode) and started browsing the directories, the last folder has a recursive
link to the top folder.

This can be seen here : http://s.guillard.free.fr/d7d-fw-bug.jpg

I'm using the latest public firmware release (only updated once since I
bought the camera late 2004.

Kind regards,

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Stéphane

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Jer - 01 Jul 2005 23:22 GMT

> Hi,
>
[quoted text clipped - 26 lines]
>
> Kind regards,

Ouch! Firmware release 1.10 is the latest on this side of the pond.
Also, since I've had mine, I've "diagnosed" all three 1Gb cards here by
shooting enough crap shots to fill each card to the point of the "card
full" complaint - no problems whatsoever - and this tested the batteries
too. I wonder what may happen with your card under the same
circumstances after you've reformatted it. Instead of a firmware issue,
it may just be a bad area on the card which doesn't manifest itself
until it's almost full. A second card may help you with this same test.

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jer
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Darrell - 02 Jul 2005 00:11 GMT

Stéphane Guillard wrote:

> Hi,
>
[quoted text clipped - 27 lines]
>
> Kind regards,

Hmmm, I see many folders do you ever format the card in camera or are you
just going to file it with empty folders? Format the card and see if the
error still exists. BTW why such a small card, in RAW mode that would hold
around 20 images or less.

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Stéphane Guillard - 04 Jul 2005 15:04 GMT

Hi,

> Hmmm, I see many folders

Then buy another pair of glasses :) there is exactly 4 daily folders in the
root directory "DCIM"). The problem is that the camera firmware somehow
fsck-ed the filesystem structures when deleting pictures in the full CF,
which ended up with the last folder having a link to the root dir (creating
an endless recursive chain, which just broke the firmware's ability to use
the CF).

> do you ever format the card in camera

No, so far I did that only once, and saw no reason to do it. After I
download pictures from the CF to the computer (using the USB cable, thus the
camera's firmware is the only actor manipulating the filesystem's
structures), I delete the daily folders. Until this incident happened,
everything had been fine.

> or are you just going to file it with empty folders?

???

> Format the card and see if the error still exists.

Of course, the filesystem structure error went away after reformatting the
CF. But the fact that it happened, without ever pulling the CF out of the
camera, is a tangible proof of firmware bug.

> BTW why such a small card, in RAW mode that would hold around 20 images or
> less.

I don't see the relevance of this comment. I shoot in xfine JPG, and I'm
jsut happy with my CF? which holds typically 2 x the amount of pictures I
was used to put on a 24 shot film.

Kind regards,

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Stéphane Guillard

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Stéphane Guillard - 04 Jul 2005 14:58 GMT

Hi,

>> I've finally found something bad with my 7D :)
>> I have set the picture storage mode to large jpegs, one file folder per
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
>> I'm using the latest public firmware release (only updated once since I
>> bought the camera late 2004.

> Ouch! Firmware release 1.10 is the latest on this side of the pond.

This is the one I use.

>Also, since I've had mine, I've "diagnosed" all three 1Gb cards here by
>shooting enough crap shots to fill each card to the point of the "card
>full" complaint - no problems whatsoever - and this tested the batteries
>too.

You not having problem is not a proof of bug absence, but me having problem
is a proof of bug presence...

Furthermore, it is not when card went full that the folder in folder
recursive nesting problem appeared, it is after I deleted a couple of shots
here and there to "make room" for extra shots, that the camera started
acting weird.

This is obviously a filesystem code bug (I know, I've coded a FAT file
system myself for my Apple 2 [http://s.guillard.free.fr], and it took me
long before it was 100% safe :)

>I wonder what may happen with your card under the same circumstances after
>you've reformatted it.

Of course, as soon as the CF was reformatted, everything was back again...
Until bug shows again :)

>Instead of a firmware issue, it may just be a bad area on the card which
>doesn't manifest itself until it's almost full. A second card may help you
>with this same test.

A second card is handy, no doubt. But I still put it on a firmware bug
(there is no reason there would be none).

Regards,

Signature

Stéphane Guillard

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Jer - 04 Jul 2005 19:23 GMT

> Hi,
>
[quoted text clipped - 28 lines]
> You not having problem is not a proof of bug absence, but me having problem
> is a proof of bug presence...

I wasn't intending to dispell a bug report, only to relate my own
flawless, albeit limited, experience with my own cards.

> Furthermore, it is not when card went full that the folder in folder
> recursive nesting problem appeared, it is after I deleted a couple of shots
> here and there to "make room" for extra shots, that the camera started
> acting weird.

Yup, you did say that (thanks for the reminder).

> This is obviously a filesystem code bug (I know, I've coded a FAT file
> system myself for my Apple 2 [http://s.guillard.free.fr], and it took me
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
> A second card is handy, no doubt. But I still put it on a firmware bug
> (there is no reason there would be none).

I wouldn't be so quick to condemn the firmware - we don't appear to have
enough info to do that - yet. Firmware bugs are expected to be
repeatable under predictive circumstances, and often by more than just
one user. Your issue appears be a little green for that, but you also
may only be the first of many from 7D users still lining up at the
internet door.

I don't have any 256Mb CF cards to play with, but I haven't been to the
store yet either. Creating the daily folders should be easy by humping
the calendar, though I'm curious if the aggregate file count is
relevant, were your file deletions consecutive (or not), at the end of
the FAT chain (or not).

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jer
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mcl - 04 Aug 2005 00:35 GMT

Post your problem here.
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/forum.asp?forum=1035
Much more active newsgroup than this one.

Stéphane Guillard wrote:

> Hi,
>
[quoted text clipped - 28 lines]
> You not having problem is not a proof of bug absence, but me having
> problem is a proof of bug presence...

I wasn't intending to dispell a bug report, only to relate my own
flawless, albeit limited, experience with my own cards.

> Furthermore, it is not when card went full that the folder in folder
> recursive nesting problem appeared, it is after I deleted a couple of
> shots here and there to "make room" for extra shots, that the camera
> started acting weird.

Yup, you did say that (thanks for the reminder).

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jer
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Jer - 01 Jul 2005 23:28 GMT

> Hi,
>
> I've finally found something bad with my 7D :)

[....]

Oh, forget to mention, I'm using Lexar 1GB 80x WA cards for what it's worth.

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jer
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