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Photo Forum / Film Photography / Darkroom / November 2005overdeveloped edges on 120 film
I am getting overdeveloped edges on my 120 film. I'm using metal reels and I've tried rolling the canister and inverting the canister. It has gotten to the point where I am inverting once every minute and I'm still getting overdeveloped edges. Does anyone have any suggestions of how to get rid of this? thank you . > I am getting overdeveloped edges on my 120 film. I'm using metal reels > and I've tried rolling the canister and inverting the canister. It has > gotten to the point where I am inverting once every minute and I'm > still getting overdeveloped edges. Does anyone have any suggestions of > how to get rid of this? thank you Could you describe the overdeveloped edges in detail? Everybody has a different 'off the top of my head' image of what 'overdeveloped edges' look like. If you can put a scan on www that is even better and often leads to a speedy answer.  SignatureNicholas O. Lindan, Cleveland, Ohio Consulting Engineer: Electronics; Informatics; Photonics. To reply, remove spaces: n o lindan at ix . netcom . com Fstop timer - http://www.nolindan.com/da/fstop/index.htm The edge of the roll, meaning the side of the roll touching the reels. There is a greater density of silver developing along these edges. It reaches in approx. a sixth of the way on each side and then bleeds into the properly developed center. It is similar to the overdevelopment that tends to occur on 35mm due to the sprocket holes. > The edge of the roll, meaning the side of the roll touching the reels. > There is a greater density of silver developing along these edges. It > reaches in approx. a sixth of the way on each side and then bleeds into > the properly developed center. It is similar to the overdevelopment > that tends to occur on 35mm due to the sprocket holes. It is perfectly normal for the very edge to show a little extra density, right at the boundary of the clear area. I suspect you may not be agitating ENOUGH. Kodak says every 30 seconds, but not for how long. I've standardized on 5 seconds' of agitation at 30 second intervals. I do that with two inversions, and I twist the tank around its axis while inverting. That's a lot of sloshing, all right, but it means the developer is getting fairly evenly distributed across the film surface, so development should be uniform. If this agitation technique produces UNIFORM overdevelopment, cut back on the total development TIME. (E.g., cut back to 8 minutes from 10.) Hope this helps: it sure works for me. Good luck, Dick Behan >I am getting overdeveloped edges on my 120 film. I'm using metal reels > and I've tried rolling the canister and inverting the canister. It has > gotten to the point where I am inverting once every minute and I'm > still getting overdeveloped edges. Does anyone have any suggestions of > how to get rid of this? thank you > I suspect you may not be agitating ENOUGH. No, more likely far too much! Kodak says every 30 seconds, but > not for how long. I've standardized on 5 seconds' of agitation at 30 second > intervals. I do that with two inversions, and I twist the tank around its [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > still getting overdeveloped edges. Does anyone have any suggestions of > > how to get rid of this? thank you UC: Here's my reasoning for suggesting too little agitation. It seems this chap had tried reducing his agitation until he was doing only one inversion per minute, suspecting the overdeveloped edges resulted from too much. Seems to me he'd gone too far--until he was UNDERdeveloping the center portion of the film. This is one of those "everything's relative" situations, in other words. I know that two (twisting) inversions every 30 works fine for me (Tri-X, D-76 1:1, btw), and that's a helluva lot more than one per minute. So: maybe not ENOUGH? Cheers. >> I suspect you may not be agitating ENOUGH. > [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] >> > still getting overdeveloped edges. Does anyone have any suggestions of >> > how to get rid of this? thank you Not likely. Increased flow affects the edges of the film more than the center. The more violent the agitation, the more differential there is. My experience watching beginners agitate is that they tend to over-do it, sometimes violently. > UC: > Here's my reasoning for suggesting too little agitation. It seems this chap [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] > >> > still getting overdeveloped edges. Does anyone have any suggestions of > >> > how to get rid of this? thank you >I am getting overdeveloped edges on my 120 film. I'm using metal reels >and I've tried rolling the canister and inverting the canister. It has >gotten to the point where I am inverting once every minute and I'm >still getting overdeveloped edges. Does anyone have any suggestions of >how to get rid of this? thank you November 16, 2005, from Lloyd Erlick, Without knowing what type of film, how you rated its EI, the type of developer, developer dilution and development time, I would guess you are using developer undiluted or nearly undiluted, and developing for too short a time. Find a development strategy that involves relatively dilute developer and development times longer than about six or seven minutes. For 120 format film (TMY) I use Xtol or D-76 diluted, for times around twelve minutes. Frankly, I consider even seven minutes too short to expect evenness. The longer development time promotes even development. It's probable I'm wrong, so my legal staff are demanding I warn you not to trust anything I say, and test on unimportant work before going into the real world. regards, --le Signature________________________________ Lloyd Erlick Portraits, Toronto. voice: 416-686-0326 email: portrait@heylloyd.com net: www.heylloyd.com ________________________________ >I am getting overdeveloped edges on my 120 film. I'm using >metal reels [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > suggestions of > how to get rid of this? thank you Are you filling the tank completely? Partial filling tends to increase the turbulance at the narrow openings at the edges of the film. Is the increase uniform on both edges or only one? Signature--- Richard Knoppow Los Angeles, CA, USA dickburk@ix.netcom.com Could this be a light leak in an old camera or faulty back with old light seals? >I am getting overdeveloped edges on my 120 film. I'm using metal reels > and I've tried rolling the canister and inverting the canister. It has > gotten to the point where I am inverting once every minute and I'm > still getting overdeveloped edges. Does anyone have any suggestions of > how to get rid of this? thank you > Could this be a light leak in an old camera > or faulty back with old light seals? The OP could fill us in some more. That's what I was thinking most likely, light leaks. Dan Yeh, the edges can't be overdeveloped, or developed at all, unless they're exposed first. >> Could this be a light leak in an old camera >> or faulty back with old light seals? > > The OP could fill us in some more. That's what > I was thinking most likely, light leaks. Dan It is not a light leak, my color film is fine, also a light leak would obviously cause overexposure not overdevelopment. I have not reached the point where the center of my film is underexposed. I am using D-76 one to one for anywhere from 8-10 minutes depending on how much I'm pulling the film (I'm usually using Tri-X which I rate at 200 or 100 depending on lighting conditions). I have no problems developing 35mm film. I know it's something that happens, but I also know that it doesn't happen to everyone. So I'm trying to figure out exactly what variable exists in what I do that doesn't exist for others. I can burn in the edges easily but it takes more time and it's annoying so i would like to avoid it as much as possible. I'd also like to know what reels and tanks everyone is using. I've got Hewes reels and I thought I would try plastic but I haven't used those in years and i couldn't get the film to load. So anything more anyone could suggest. Thank you. >It is not a light leak, my color film is fine, also a light leak would >obviously cause overexposure not overdevelopment. I have not reached [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >try plastic but I haven't used those in years and i couldn't get the >film to load. So anything more anyone could suggest. Thank you. I had the same problem with 120 film edge overdevelopment many many years ago. The solutions for me were: (1) Use standard procedure: Agitate vigorously, but not too vigorously, using the "torus" method, with rapping to dislodge air bells; and agitate continuously the first 30 seconds, then for 5 seconds or 2 inversions at every 30 second interval thereafter. (2) Switch to Paterson plastic tanks and reels which, to me, seem to give more even development of 120 than metal reels as well as being easier to load. HTH. SignatureLuke ___________________________________________________________________ "The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness." -- John Kenneth Galbraith |
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