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Photo Forum / Film Photography / Darkroom / February 2005

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Opinions on Paper

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Scott Coutts - 24 Feb 2005 13:16 GMT
Hi Folks,

I'm pretty new to darkroom work, and I'm getting back into processing
prints in the darkroom after a long time (I havent done it since high
school about 14 years ago)... Does anyone have any comments or opinions
about these (resin coated) papers? They're the ones available to me at
the moment:

Ilford Multigrade RC
Agfa Multicontrast Premium
Tetenal Vario RC
Kodak Polymax RC
Fotospeed PA RC

The only paper I've used before is the Ilford paper. They all seem to be
roughly the same price except the Tetenal, which is roughly half the
price of the others... is it any good?

Cheers,

Scott.
Frank Pittel - 24 Feb 2005 13:28 GMT
The only RC paper I've used is the Ilford Multigrade. It's alright for
an RC paper. I've seen prints made on the Kodak Polymax and prefered the
Ilford paper to it.

After you get back into the flow of printing again you should do yourself
a favor and look into a couple of the fiber papers.

: Hi Folks,

: I'm pretty new to darkroom work, and I'm getting back into processing
: prints in the darkroom after a long time (I havent done it since high
: school about 14 years ago)... Does anyone have any comments or opinions
: about these (resin coated) papers? They're the ones available to me at
: the moment:

: Ilford Multigrade RC
: Agfa Multicontrast Premium
: Tetenal Vario RC
: Kodak Polymax RC
: Fotospeed PA RC

: The only paper I've used before is the Ilford paper. They all seem to be
: roughly the same price except the Tetenal, which is roughly half the
: price of the others... is it any good?

: Cheers,

: Scott.

Signature

Keep working millions on welfare depend on you
-------------------
fwp@deepthought.com

Michelle A. - 24 Feb 2005 14:06 GMT
> The only RC paper I've used is the Ilford Multigrade. It's alright for
> an RC paper. I've seen prints made on the Kodak Polymax and prefered the
[quoted text clipped - 24 lines]
>
> : Scott.

I've only been printing in the darkroom for about 2 years now, so I'm no
expert, and I usually use fiber paper, but if I'm using RC my choice is
usually the Ilford Multigrade RC.  Kodak's Polycontrast III in lustre is
one that I also like, but I only had a small sample pack I had gotten at
a convention to try out.

Signature

Michelle Amarante

http://www.michelleamarante.com
http://www.photo-genesis.net/

Steven Kefford - 24 Feb 2005 16:24 GMT
...

> After you get back into the flow of printing again you should do yourself
> a favor and look into a couple of the fiber papers.
...

Yes. I did my first FB prints the other night, along with an RC of the
same shot. Although it might be my processing, I did prefer the FB. Much
better tones.

Steve
Scott Coutts - 25 Feb 2005 00:34 GMT
> The only RC paper I've used is the Ilford Multigrade. It's alright for
> an RC paper. I've seen prints made on the Kodak Polymax and prefered the
> Ilford paper to it.
>
> After you get back into the flow of printing again you should do yourself
> a favor and look into a couple of the fiber papers.

Yeah, I certainly will. But I also have to use the paper for a
photography course I'm doing, and they start us off on RC paper first,
then move to fibre paper later on. I'm looking forward to it (:

Scott.
Frank Pittel - 25 Feb 2005 04:59 GMT
: > The only RC paper I've used is the Ilford Multigrade. It's alright for
: > an RC paper. I've seen prints made on the Kodak Polymax and prefered the
: > Ilford paper to it.
: >
: > After you get back into the flow of printing again you should do yourself
: > a favor and look into a couple of the fiber papers.

: Yeah, I certainly will. But I also have to use the paper for a
: photography course I'm doing, and they start us off on RC paper first,
: then move to fibre paper later on. I'm looking forward to it (:

I agree with the idea of learning to print on RC paper. The dry to dry
processing time is lower and it much cheaper then fiber paper.
Signature


Keep working millions on welfare depend on you
-------------------
fwp@deepthought.com

laura halliday - 24 Feb 2005 16:34 GMT
I always seem to come back to Ilford Multigrade IV RC, though I've
played with some of the Kodak and Forte papers too.

Why not buy the smallest package you can of each and compare them
yourself? They're *your* pictures, and you are the only one you need to
please with how they turn out.

I'm in the process of doing this myself, having a need for some graded
RC paper (PMK negatives). So I chose a couple of likely candidates and
placed an order with B&H for a couple of 25 sheet packages.

Laura Halliday VE7LDH     "Que les nuages soient notre
Grid: CN89mg                    pied a terre..."
ICBM: 49 16.05 N 122 56.92 W       - Hospital/Shafte
Scott Coutts - 25 Feb 2005 00:38 GMT
> I always seem to come back to Ilford Multigrade IV RC, though I've
> played with some of the Kodak and Forte papers too.
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> RC paper (PMK negatives). So I chose a couple of likely candidates and
> placed an order with B&H for a couple of 25 sheet packages.

Yeah, I'll probably do that at some stage, but at the moment I have to
buy a box to use for a course I'm doing too... so I'd like to stick with
one paper while I'm learning the process (again!) Once I'm familiar with
it, then I'll examine some other papers. Also, I cant afford it, tiven
that they cost me about $25 a box and there's maybe 5 to look at to
start with (:
Louie Powell - 24 Feb 2005 19:52 GMT
Scott Coutts <scott.coutts@med.monash.edu.au> wrote in news:DskTd.173958
$K7.145357@news-server.bigpond.net.au:

> Hi Folks,
>
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
> roughly the same price except the Tetenal, which is roughly half the
> price of the others... is it any good?

Fred -

Ilford, Agfa and Kodak are fairly ubiquitous papers.  I've used a lot of
Ilford (mostly as repackaged by Arista/Freestyle) - its a good neutral
tone papaer.  I've used a little Agfa - my sense is that its a colder
tone, but I can't consider myself an expert.  Used to use Kodak, but
haven't in many years.

One of the issues with paper is availabiltiy.  I live in a remote area
where it's difficult to purchase paper directly from a dealer in a store.  
Most of my paper purchases are by telephone or the web, and that is one
of the factors that has driven me in the direction of Ilford/Arista.

I don't believe that Fotospeed or Tetenal actually make their own paper.  
If so, the question is whose paper are they repackaging.  The major
candidates are Ilford and Forte.  Both companies have been going through
some financial problems, but the latest news appears to be that Ilford
will survive.  The bottom line is not yet known with Forte.  

The reason this is an issue is that, IMO, the best strategy is to pick a
paper and stick with it for several years while you hone your skills as a
photographer/printer.  Madly changing paper introduces another variable
into the equation and will only screw up the learning process.  
Therefore, you want to choose a paper that you are reasonably certain
will continue to be available.
Scott Coutts - 25 Feb 2005 00:39 GMT
> Scott Coutts <scott.coutts@med.monash.edu.au> wrote in news:DskTd.173958
> $K7.145357@news-server.bigpond.net.au:
[quoted text clipped - 45 lines]
> Therefore, you want to choose a paper that you are reasonably certain
> will continue to be available.

Yes, I agree completely, which is why I was asking for some comments,
and why I replied to another post as I did... I'm sure there will be
enough for me to do just to get good, consistent prints on one type of
paper, let alone a whole range. Once i'm up and running, then I'll try a
few others. But for now, I was just trying to see if there's a general
consensus on which papers are good or bad.
Neal - 25 Feb 2005 07:18 GMT
I've never had problems with ilford MGIV
laura halliday - 25 Feb 2005 22:48 GMT
Short answer: they're all good.

I think it's important to avoid the paralysis-by-analysis syndrome. Buy
some paper. Any paper. Print something on it. If you like it, use it.
If you don't, try another kind. But, above all, do *something*.

When I told the folks at the local camera store what I wanted to do
they handed me a pack of Multigrade IV. It has a reputation of being
easy to work with (idiot-proof, even), which is well-deserved. You can
print nice pictures on it, too.

Laura Halliday VE7LDH     "Que les nuages soient notre
Grid: CN89mg                    pied a terre..."
ICBM: 49 16.05 N 122 56.92 W       - Hospital/Shafte
Scott Coutts - 26 Feb 2005 03:59 GMT
> Short answer: they're all good.
>
> I think it's important to avoid the paralysis-by-analysis syndrome.

I dont suffer that syndrome, and never will (: But I also like to make
some kind of informed decision before buying anything (:

> Buy
> some paper. Any paper. Print something on it. If you like it, use it.
> If you don't, try another kind. But, above all, do *something*.

I will, but having had litte experience, I would like to stick with the
paper I buy for a significant period while I learn, and learn only on
that paper. Then once I have mastered the techniques, and can produce
consistent good-quality prints on that paper, then try others. SO I
would like to choose a good paper to begin with. I cant evaluate the
papers properly with the skill level that I currently have, so I'm
seeking the opinions of those who can.

> When I told the folks at the local camera store what I wanted to do
> they handed me a pack of Multigrade IV. It has a reputation of being
> easy to work with (idiot-proof, even), which is well-deserved. You can
> print nice pictures on it, too.

Yeah, I was originially going to buy that because it is the only one
I've ever used. I think  I might go with the Agfa though, this time.

Cheers,

Scott.
Richard Knoppow - 25 Feb 2005 09:16 GMT
> Hi Folks,
>
[quoted text clipped - 19 lines]
>
> Scott.

  I haven't used Tetenal or Photospeed, which I think is
sold under a different name in this country, but I've used a
lot of the others. Kodak, Ilford, and Agfa are all good
papers but look a little different. The differences are hard
to describe and can be subtle. Unlike some other posters to
this thread I don't think fiber based paper is significantly
better than RC, at least as far as tone rendition is
concerned. One difference is that most RC papers (but not
Ilford) contain developer so that they can be used in rapid
access activation processors. The developer in the emulsion
tends to make the paper somewhat less flexible in the
developer than fiber, which does not have the developer.
  The quality of prints on any kind of paper is dependant
on having good negatives; a poor negative will not give you
an outstanding print on any material.
  You can try small packages of each paper and work with
each a little. Compare the results the next day in normal
illumination. There is always some change in the print as it
dries. Often your opinion of a print in the darkroom will
change when you see it in normal light.
  Developer makes a relatively minor difference but the
color of the image may vary with the developer. At the
moment I am using Agfa Neutol Plus, a Phenidone and ascorbic
acid print developer. It is very clean working and seems to
have large capacity. I use the "economy" dilution 1:9.

Signature

---
Richard Knoppow
Los Angeles, CA, USA
dickburk@ix.netcom.com

 
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