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Photo Forum / Film Photography / Darkroom / July 2004

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Ferraniacolor regular 8mm, 25 asa, dated 1967

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Proczybar - 10 Jul 2004 01:00 GMT
Does anybody have any idea of what process was required in order
to develop Ferraniacolor regular 8mm, 25 asa daylight, dated about 1967?

It looks to me that it may well be E2 or E4 or a similar process, but I
am not sure, since at the time Ferrania use to be in co-operation with
Agfa.
Any idea?
Thanks.
Proxybar
Donald Qualls - 10 Jul 2004 04:25 GMT
> Does anybody have any idea of what process was required in order
> to develop Ferraniacolor regular 8mm, 25 asa daylight, dated about 1967?
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> Agfa.
> Any idea?

I suppose you could try contacting Ferrania -- they're still in business
in Italy, IIRC producing the last 126 Instamatic film anywhere on Earth
(one emulsion, Ferraniacolor 200, I think only in 20 exposures).

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Scott Dorsey - 10 Jul 2004 16:09 GMT
>> Does anybody have any idea of what process was required in order
>> to develop Ferraniacolor regular 8mm, 25 asa daylight, dated about 1967?
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>in Italy, IIRC producing the last 126 Instamatic film anywhere on Earth
>(one emulsion, Ferraniacolor 200, I think only in 20 exposures).

Contact Rocky Mountain Film Labs.  They still do hand-processing of old
film and can mix up both E4 and Agfa chemistry from reagents.  If anyone
is familiar with the old Ferrania stock, it is probably them.

Ferrania is still around and still has US representation, but the folks
in the US don't seem to know anything about cine films and I doubt they
know about the older stocks.  It's worth calling them anyway just to see.
--scott
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Steve Kraus - 11 Jul 2004 02:16 GMT
> IIRC producing the last 126 Instamatic film anywhere on Earth
> (one emulsion, Ferraniacolor 200, I think only in 20 exposures).

Say it ain't so; my youth is slipping away.  What is the status of 110?
Roman J. Rohleder - 11 Jul 2004 02:20 GMT
Steve Kraus <screen@SPAMBLOCKfilmteknik.com> schrieb:

>> IIRC producing the last 126 Instamatic film anywhere on Earth
>> (one emulsion, Ferraniacolor 200, I think only in 20 exposures).
>
>Say it ain't so; my youth is slipping away.  What is the status of 110?

I don´t know of 126 (I don´t believe they keep up the production), but
type 110 is in production - under the label "Solaris", by Ferrania.
And some shops in germany still sell fresh Agfa- and Fuji in 110.

Gruss, Roman
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Scott Norwood - 11 Jul 2004 03:47 GMT
>I don?t know of 126 (I don?t believe they keep up the production), but
>type 110 is in production - under the label "Solaris", by Ferrania.
>And some shops in germany still sell fresh Agfa- and Fuji in 110.

Kodak still makes 110, too, or at least they did until very recently.
I've seen it on store shelves in the last month or so.  Since 35mm
disposable cameras and processing are now quite cheap and the
quality is remarkably good for what it is (not to mention digital,
although I doubt that the typical 110 user would have any interest
in that), I can't really imagine why a 110 market still exists,
but evidently it does.

Supposedly there were a couple of decent 110 cameras that were made
in the 1970s (by "decent," I mean that they had good lenses and
could be manually adjusted), but even that sort of begs the question
of "why?".

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Christian Kolinski - 12 Jul 2004 16:18 GMT
In rec.photo.darkroom Scott Norwood <snorwood@redballoon.net> wrote:

>>I don´t know of 126 (I don´t believe they keep up the production), but
>>type 110 is in production - under the label "Solaris", by Ferrania.
>>And some shops in germany still sell fresh Agfa- and Fuji in 110.

> Kodak still makes 110, too, or at least they did until very recently.
> I've seen it on store shelves in the last month or so.  Since 35mm
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> in that), I can't really imagine why a 110 market still exists,
> but evidently it does.

> Supposedly there were a couple of decent 110 cameras that were made
> in the 1970s (by "decent," I mean that they had good lenses and
> could be manually adjusted), but even that sort of begs the question
> of "why?".

That's exactly why. They don't even have to be decent ones.
They fit their purpose the last 25 years: producing small
3x4" prints to show around on bithdays or other family events.
There foolproof.
Maybe it was a present.
It has been with them in Rome, Paris, NY, SF, Honeymoon
and took pictures of baby's fist step, fist day at school,
Grandpa's 80th bithday. Sentimental.
So a lot of folks keep their 110.
A lot of people only stoped using their Instamatics
because 126-film isn't availiable at WalMart anymore.
Most of those use disposables nowadaaays.

Chris.
Joseph Goodman - 13 Jul 2004 02:57 GMT
> Supposedly there were a couple of decent 110 cameras that were made
> in the 1970s (by "decent," I mean that they had good lenses and
> could be manually adjusted),

The Pentax Auto 110 SLR was more than just decent IMO...

but even that sort of begs the question
> of "why?".

Everybody loves obsolete gadgets!
Donald Qualls - 13 Jul 2004 05:56 GMT
>>I don? know of 126 (I don? believe they keep up the production), but
>>type 110 is in production - under the label "Solaris", by Ferrania.
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
> could be manually adjusted), but even that sort of begs the question
> of "why?".

The Pentax Auto 110 was a very good camera by any standard.  It produced
images on 110 film (13x17 frame, just about 1/4 of the 35 mm frame) that
were better than most of the simpler 35 mm cameras of the day (late
1970s, early 1980s) and better quality than a lot of the lower end (not
even counting disposables and their close relatives) even today.  Sure,
it was a lot more camera, and a lot more money, than the 35 mm cheapies,
but it was also much smaller; it nestled nicely in the hand, and a full
kit with four lenses (normal, wide, tele, and zoom) plus a
tele-extender, would fit in a case not much bigger than a 6x9 cm folding
camera, closed.

In fact, though, 110 pretty well killed the subminiature formats --
Minolta, Yashica, and Mamiya produced compatible 16 mm cassettes and
cameras for them starting in the late 1950s, and did reasonably well
with them (they had good lenses, for the most part, and many were fully
adjustable, though focusing was always inconvenient due to size and the
very short travel needed to focus a moving lens).  When Kodak came out
with 110, it was a case of the cuckoo pushing the other chicks out of
the nest as it grew -- and then flying away when the quality of most 110
cameras disappointed users, most of whom never saw the images that could
be made with a Pentax or Minolta SLR or even the higher end adjustable
viewfinder cameras for 110 (some of which, in the early 1980s, had
features Minolta had put into their 16 mm cameras prior to 1970 -- but
were easily twice the camera size).

When public interest in 110 waned, the other submini formats (except
Minox) were gone -- Minolta continued to produce film until the mid-90s
that could be used in some Yashica and Mamiya cameras as well, but the
others, the Rollei 16, the Steky, even the Soviet 16 mm SLR had been
driven from the market by 110.

Now, Minox is the only still film format smaller than APS still in
production, and that's only because the manufacturers, supporting 70
years of their history (and with the backing of a deep pocketed
corporate parent) continue to purchase bulk film, mostly from Agfa, and
slit it for their cassettes.

I don't recall 110 images as being a lot worse than 126, given similar
levels of camera -- and I've had pictures from my Minolta 16 cameras
that would give a half-frame 35 mm a good run, or outdo a 35 mm
snapshooter.  But Kodak had to stir the pot again, thinking people
wanted still smaller cameas -- and so Disk was born, with flat cameras
(that presaged modern digital designs), tiny negatives that weren't
supported by anything resembling the lens quality of the Minox (which
uses the exact same image size, 8x11 mm, but in much more compact
packaging) and printed on mass market quality equipment -- and still
managed to show up the limitations of the film, more than those of the
camera.  And with 110 now orphaned, once Kodak quit producing those
cameras, and Disk deservedly circling the drain, other companies quit
producing 110 cameras in droves -- even the few good cameras among them.

Now, it's a fair amount of effort just to find a lab that will process
110 film, at least in the United States.

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I may be a scwewy wabbit, but I'm not going to Alcatwaz!
                                                    -- E. J. Fudd, 1954

Donald Qualls, aka The Silent Observer
Lathe Building Pages  http://silent1.home.netcom.com/HomebuiltLathe.htm
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Opinions expressed are my own -- take them for what they're worth
and don't expect them to be perfect.

Donald Qualls - 11 Jul 2004 04:35 GMT
>>IIRC producing the last 126 Instamatic film anywhere on Earth
>>(one emulsion, Ferraniacolor 200, I think only in 20 exposures).
>
> Say it ain't so; my youth is slipping away.  What is the status of 110?

Last I heard, Fuji was still making a couple emulsions in 110, both 200
and 400 speed; Ferrania might also make one.  Might be interesting to
have processed, since most one-hour places don't like to admit their
machines can handle anything other than 35 mm and APS, but it's out there.

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I may be a scwewy wabbit, but I'm not going to Alcatwaz!
                                                    -- E. J. Fudd, 1954

Donald Qualls, aka The Silent Observer
Lathe Building Pages  http://silent1.home.netcom.com/HomebuiltLathe.htm
Speedway 7x12 Lathe Pages     http://silent1.home.netcom.com/my7x12.htm

Opinions expressed are my own -- take them for what they're worth
and don't expect them to be perfect.

Proczybar - 11 Jul 2004 10:10 GMT
I spoke with Ferrania last week and they are investigating on the issue.
Some other people I have been in contact with suggested that it may
well be either
a) Agfacolor/ORWO compatible film
b) a much easier and less toxic process that could be done by amatours
c) an Ektachome compatible proces
As they told me, a) was when there was a mailer for pre-paid process
whereas b) was when process was not included in the price.
Whereas c) was at the very end of the 60's when Ferrania was bought by 3M.
Have you got any thoughts about this?

Also, about 110 and 126:
Ferrania still produce fresh 126 Films, 200 asa, branded Solaris.
Check it out on www.ferraniait.com
They also produce fresh 110 film 200 asa branded Solaris.
The guy from Ferrania confirmed everything and told me that in Japan
at the moment there is a big 126 revival and the most of 126 costumers are
there.

About where developing your 126 and 110, both colour (c41) and black&white
I suggest you send your films to this lab called Top Foto Services
http://www.topfotoservices.co.uk
You can also ask them to send you a mailer where you can put your films and
send
it to them. They are in Cornwall, in the Great Britain (UK). Quite cheap too.
Proczybar

> >>IIRC producing the last 126 Instamatic film anywhere on Earth
> >>(one emulsion, Ferraniacolor 200, I think only in 20 exposures).
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
> Opinions expressed are my own -- take them for what they're worth
> and don't expect them to be perfect.
Scott Dorsey - 11 Jul 2004 14:46 GMT
>> IIRC producing the last 126 Instamatic film anywhere on Earth
>> (one emulsion, Ferraniacolor 200, I think only in 20 exposures).
>
>Say it ain't so; my youth is slipping away.  What is the status of 110?

I dunno, but I was looking for a steel 110 reel to process short lengths
of 16mm by hand for camera tests, and Kindermann doesn't make them any
more.  Everyone laughed when I asked.  I had to buy an expensive Jobo
plastic reel that was designed for 16mm test films.
--scott

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Nicholas O. Lindan - 12 Jul 2004 16:46 GMT
"Scott Dorsey" <kludge@panix.com> wrote

> I was looking for a steel 110 reel to process short lengths
> of 16mm by hand

These are quite common, at least in our local camera store that
specializes in used darkroom 'junque'.

Foto Center
Cleveland, Ohio

Listed in yellowpages.com, I'm sure.

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Scott Dorsey - 13 Jul 2004 17:17 GMT
>"Scott Dorsey" <kludge@panix.com> wrote
>
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>Foto Center
>Cleveland, Ohio

I just got off the phone with them.  They threw the box of them in the
dumpster a week ago.

If you have any other source, let me know....
--scott
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Peter Chant - 11 Jul 2004 11:35 GMT
> I suppose you could try contacting Ferrania -- they're still in business
> in Italy, IIRC producing the last 126 Instamatic film anywhere on Earth
> (one emulsion, Ferraniacolor 200, I think only in 20 exposures).

Maybe I ought to get some for my dad, he expressed surprise when I
told him you could not get film for his instamatic.

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Donald Qualls - 11 Jul 2004 15:43 GMT
>>I suppose you could try contacting Ferrania -- they're still in business
>>in Italy, IIRC producing the last 126 Instamatic film anywhere on Earth
>>(one emulsion, Ferraniacolor 200, I think only in 20 exposures).
>
> Maybe I ought to get some for my dad, he expressed surprise when I
> told him you could not get film for his instamatic.

If you're interested, you can order it through www.jandcphoto.com with
reasonable UPS or USPS shipping and pretty prompt handling -- and
immediate feedback if they're out of stock (as happens sometimes, when
they sell only imported films).  Processing 126 is easier, since at
least the negatives can be processed in 35 mm machinery (assuming you
can find a lab that knows how to get the film out of the cartridge
without fogging it).

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I may be a scwewy wabbit, but I'm not going to Alcatwaz!
                                                    -- E. J. Fudd, 1954

Donald Qualls, aka The Silent Observer
Lathe Building Pages  http://silent1.home.netcom.com/HomebuiltLathe.htm
Speedway 7x12 Lathe Pages     http://silent1.home.netcom.com/my7x12.htm

Opinions expressed are my own -- take them for what they're worth
and don't expect them to be perfect.

Hemi4268 - 11 Jul 2004 16:41 GMT
Hi

Some 110 cameras do not need the sproket hole for film lineup.  If that's the
case 110 can be reloaded.  I reloaded 110 cassettes with 16mm microfilm.  It is
the same or about the same as Tech-Pan.

The cassettes just pull apart with a quick nudge.  The look like they are
welded together tightly but they are not.

Larry
 
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