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Photo Forum / General Photo Topics / Australian Photography / July 2007Rare and excellent restoration
Karmann Giha by Volkswagon http://www.ryadia.com/POD/July/22-07-07.htm  SignaturePosted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com > Karmann Giha by Volkswagonhttp://www.ryadia.com/POD/July/22-07-07.htm How about a photo of yourself, Julian? > Karmann Giha by Volkswagonhttp://www.ryadia.com/POD/July/22-07-07.htm > > -- > Posted via a free Usenet account fromhttp://www.teranews.com Another snapshot from Doug, posing as Julain.. Nice car. - Pity about the blown whites. - Pity that he can't spell Volkswagen. - Pity that he can't spell "Ghia", either in the thread or on the webpage. But hardly unexpected from someone with his talent level. > Karmann Giha by Volkswagon > http://www.ryadia.com/POD/July/22-07-07.htm Spelled Ghia & Volkswagen (I just happened to catch one the other day also :-) <http://www.edgehill.net/1/?SC=go.php&DIR=2_Human-World/2-Objects&PG=3&PIC=13> SignaturePaul Furman Photography http://www.edgehill.net/1 Bay Natives Nursery http://www.baynatives.com >> Karmann Giha by Volkswagon >> http://www.ryadia.com/POD/July/22-07-07.htm > > Spelled Ghia & Volkswagen > (I just happened to catch one the other day also :-) > <http://www.edgehill.net/1/?SC=go.php&DIR=2_Human-World/2-Objects&PG=3&PIC=13> > Paul Furman Photography Nice shot. Pity about the dent but I guess this happens when you drive on public roads. SignaturePosted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com > > Karmann Giha by Volkswagon > >http://www.ryadia.com/POD/July/22-07-07.htm > > Spelled Ghia & Volkswagen > (I just happened to catch one the other day also :-) > <http://www.edgehill.net/1/?SC=go.php&DIR=2_Human-World/2-Objects&PG=3...> I think that if you are gonna restore an old car you shouldn't choose such an ugly one. >>>Karmann Giha by Volkswagon >>>http://www.ryadia.com/POD/July/22-07-07.htm [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > I think that if you are gonna restore an old car you shouldn't choose > such an ugly one. Well, unrestored is MUCH uglier: <http://www.edgehill.net/1/?SC=go.php&DIR=California/Bay-Area/San-Francisco/gritt y/2005-08-19-mission/full-set&PG=6&PIC=33> :-) I think they are cool, but I'd definitely lose the bra on that one! SignaturePaul Furman Photography http://www.edgehill.net/1 Bay Natives Nursery http://www.baynatives.com >>>>Karmann Giha by Volkswagon >>>>http://www.ryadia.com/POD/July/22-07-07.htm [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > I think they are cool, but I'd definitely lose the bra on that one! I thought Karman Ghia's were ugly back in the 50's, but by today's standards, they are beautiful...... >>Annika1980 wrote: >>>> [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > I thought Karman Ghia's were ugly back in the 50's, but by today's > standards, they are beautiful...... I always thought they were cool, but hard to spell... on that one, I wrote 'Karmangia' Sorry for the spelling flame Doug :-) SignaturePaul Furman Photography http://www.edgehill.net/1 Bay Natives Nursery http://www.baynatives.com >>>>>> Karmann Giha by Volkswagon >>>>>> http://www.ryadia.com/POD/July/22-07-07.htm http://www.edgehill.net/1/?SC=go.php&DIR=California/Bay-Area/San-Francisco/gritt y/2005-08-19-mission/full-set&PG=5&PIC=28 Why is it that all the houses falling over? Fault area around the bay? :) >>>>>>> Karmann Giha by Volkswagon >>>>>>> http://www.ryadia.com/POD/July/22-07-07.htm [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Fault area around the bay? :) Oops... I must have been feeling a little dizzy with the wide angle :-) I do have an rough time keeping my shots level, I try harder now, that was 2 years ago... and if you go up a level, I already culled that one out. Ugh. SignaturePaul Furman Photography http://www.edgehill.net/1 Bay Natives Nursery http://www.baynatives.com > I thought Karman Ghia's were ugly back in the 50's, but by today's > standards, they are beautiful...... I thought they were ugly, expensive Volkswagens in the 50's-60's. Just more expensive now. MrT. >> I thought Karman Ghia's were ugly back in the 50's, but by today's >> standards, they are beautiful...... [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > MrT. Well, I compare that short of the restored Ghia to the ugly, boxy, SUV's I see advertised on the TV, and it looks beautiful to me.....I can't believe how America's taste has deteriorated during the last 40 years or so....There isn't anything sold today that looks half as good as my old MG-A did, and it was a very inexpensive car. Oh, they are all nice to drive, and appointed very nicely on the inside, as well....But as for looks? - They make me want to throw up........ >Well, I compare that short of the restored Ghia to the ugly, boxy, SUV's I > see advertised on the TV, and it looks beautiful to me...I can't believe [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > very nicely on the inside, as well....But as for looks? - They make me want > to throw up........ Lets see, you are comparing an old English sports car with new American trucks, why? If you don't think there are FAR better sports cars available these days than the old MG's, then nostalgia has simply warped your brain. But the sale of sports cars has always been in the minority since they are impractical for most people, regardless of cost. MrT. >>Well, I compare that short of the restored Ghia to the ugly, boxy, SUV's I >>see advertised on the TV, and it looks beautiful to me...I can't believe [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > > MrT. And they don't get any better with age. I still have one :) > If you don't think there are FAR better sports cars available these days > than the old MG's, then nostalgia has simply warped your brain. Nothing that's more just plain unadulterated *FUN* though. And a properly tuned old MG probably gets better gas mileage. >> If you don't think there are FAR better sports cars available these >> days than the old MG's, then nostalgia has simply warped your >> brain. > > Nothing that's more just plain unadulterated *FUN* though. And a > properly tuned old MG probably gets better gas mileage. I liked the MGAs for their concision and fun-ness, too, but compared to the Austin-Healey of the early 50s they were - dare I say it? - ugly. You have to face it some times. Ugly is good on the right character. This old MG (1967 B GT w/ overdrive) was getting nearly thirty mpg when it retired itself: http://farm1.static.flickr.com/62/199837316_62a1bfcff0_o.jpg ... a few weeks before it heaved a sigh and retired to a quiet place behind the house, in 1992. Still there, awaiting restoration or a lightning strike. It serves as steward of the classic yellow-on-blue California license plate "FLICK U". (You could have the car, the plate, and all the spares for just $15,000.) It has a racing history-won its class at the Tijuana Playas Road Races. Now, that was _fun_! More history: http://home.san.rr.com/fsheff/mg04.htm SignatureFrank ess "Verbing weirds language." -Calvin "Frank ess" <frank@fshe2fs.com> wrote in message news:u5adncaM7f-> I liked the MGAs for their concision and fun-ness, too, but compared > to the Austin-Healey of the early 50s they were - dare I say it? - ugly. > You have to face it some times. Ugly is good on the right character. Here is a photo of the MG "A" that's the same color as mine, but mine was a hardtop......I still think they were beautiful..... http://pages.motors.ebay.com/viewitem/viewitem_popup.html?domain=ebay.com > Here is a photo of the MG "A" that's the same color as mine, but mine was a > hardtop......I still think they were beautiful..... > http://pages.motors.ebay.com/viewitem/viewitem_popup.html?domain=ebay.com Well as they say, there's no accounting for taste, and beauty is in the eye of the beholder. MrT. >> Here is a photo of the MG "A" that's the same color as mine, but mine was > a [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > MrT. I liked the Healy's too, but the MG was cheaper....My friends Healy had an overdrive....He cut it in with a toggle switch on the dash....A nice touch, that.....Back in those days you could drive a car like that to work all week, and then take it out and race it on weekends, and sometimes win! Today you can race a "car" on weekends, but its nothing you can legally drive to work, and if you want to win, you'd better be prepared to spend a half million on it....... >Back in those days you could drive a car like that to work all > week, and then take it out and race it on weekends, and sometimes win! Today > you can race a "car" on weekends, but its nothing you can legally drive to > work, and if you want to win, you'd better be prepared to spend a half > million on it....... Which is simply an indication of how far motor racing has come, in terms of professionalism and budgets. I still remember meeting the World Champion Jim Clark in the Castrol *TENT* here 40 years ago. Even allowing for inflation, a B grade F1 driver will get more money for one race, than a multi world championship winner did in their whole career back then. Imagine trying to build your own F1 car and WIN the world title like Jack Brabham did, nowadays. :-) MrT. >>Back in those days you could drive a car like that to work all >> week, and then take it out and race it on weekends, and sometimes win! [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > MrT. Yes....Glad to hear you calling it, "Motor racing". Automobile racing it isn't. Not if you can go down to your local dealer and buy an, "automobile".....I enjoyed buying and driving something that could win races. And I would drive out to South Hampton on weekends to watch people race them, and dream of racing them myself some day.....Today, I have no interest in who wins whatever they call those contests they have with half-million dollar machines.......It's kind of like watching a basketball game.....A contest engaged in by 7 foot freaks. I would rather watch the Gibbons swinging around in their cages at the Zoo.....More athletic, and just about as easy for me to identify with....But, as you say, there's no accounting for taste...... > Yes....Glad to hear you calling it, "Motor racing". Automobile racing it > isn't. Not if you can go down to your local dealer and buy an, [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > half-million dollar machines.......It's kind of like watching a basketball > game..... Or comparing Apples with Goriillas! There are still racing categories available for standard street legal cars. The fact that you don't realise that simply means you never had any interest in finding out in the first place. MrT. >>Yes....Glad to hear you calling it, "Motor racing". Automobile racing it >>isn't. Not if you can go down to your local dealer and buy an, [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > MrT. We still taxi races between Holden and Ford :) > We still taxi races between Holden and Ford :) Agreed on the "taxi races". But they still spend millions of dollars per car per year. And they're certainly not street legal :-) MrT. >> Yes....Glad to hear you calling it, "Motor racing". Automobile racing it >> isn't. Not if you can go down to your local dealer and buy an, [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > MrT. Not anywhere that I have had to live, there weren't. And if you mean watching them on TV, then forget it....I can't think of anything more boring than to watch any kind of race on TV. No, when I left New York City in 1952, I left automobile road racing forever.......I take that back....I did see the Pacific Grand Prix in 1956 in Monterey, California....Sterling Moss won it by a nose from Dan Gurney....Moss was driving a Lotus. And that was the last road race I ever saw....... > > There are still racing categories available for standard street legal > > cars. > > The fact that you don't realise that simply means you never had any > > interest in finding out in the first place. > Not anywhere that I have had to live, there weren't. And if you mean > watching them on TV, then forget it....I can't think of anything more boring [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > it by a nose from Dan Gurney....Moss was driving a Lotus. And that was the > last road race I ever saw....... And your point is that you have lived in the wilderness ever since? How does that relate to your original assertions? MrT. >> Yes....Glad to hear you calling it, "Motor racing". Automobile racing it >> isn't. Not if you can go down to your local dealer and buy an, [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > MrT. Do they advertise these "contests"? Where are they held? - On simple oval tracks with no switchback turns? - You are probably right....I've got no interest in finding out in the first place......For several different reasons....... > Do they advertise these "contests"? Where are they held? - On simple oval > tracks with no switchback turns? - No, mostly on standard "road" type racetracks. But of course there are all types of car race categories including drag racing, dirt rallies etc. which cater for standard cars with the addition of minimal safety equipment. >You are probably right....I've got no > interest in finding out in the first place......For several different > reasons....... So why complain that something doesn't exist any more, when it clearly does, and you simply have no interest in knowing the facts? MrT. >> Do they advertise these "contests"? Where are they held? - On simple oval >> tracks with no switchback turns? - [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > which > cater for standard cars with the addition of minimal safety equipment. That's most of the problem right there....Complexity....I am getting too old to bother with it. I am not interested in watching Detroit Behemoths roar around an oval track, especially when I find out that the cars only, "look" like the behemoths, but are actually half-million dollar remakes of Detroit scrap iron. - I just don't want to bother sorting it all out.......I long for the simpler world of my youth, where things were likely to be what they seemed to be....... > > No, mostly on standard "road" type racetracks. But of course there are all > > types of car race categories including drag racing, dirt rallies etc. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > That's most of the problem right there....Complexity....I am getting too old > to bother with it. Which is of course the problem, nothing to do with your original (incorrect) assertion that you can no longer race like the old days because street categories no longer exist like they once did. In fact the minimum requirements for safety equipment have hardly changed at all in most cases. In any case, just drive and/or collect whatever makes you happy, no need to argue about which is better. MrT. >> > No, mostly on standard "road" type racetracks. But of course there are > all [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > MrT. Well, we agree on one thing....the Miata is a very nice car for the money, and I think I am going to buy one. > Well, we agree on one thing....the Miata is a very nice car for the money, > and I think I am going to buy one. Good idea. Your only problem is to decide on the roadster, or the hardtop :-) MrT. >> Well, we agree on one thing....the Miata is a very nice car for the >> money, [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > MrT. Believe it or not, I am trying to decide on the manual transmission, or the automatic.....My arthritis makes it hard for me to shift gears on a manual transmission....I would like to have the rag top, but I would want a good roll bar installed, first. I don't know whether that is possible, or advisable. >> Yes....Glad to hear you calling it, "Motor racing". Automobile >> racing it isn't. Not if you can go down to your local dealer and [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > MrT. Seems to me there may be some truth in what you say, Mr T., but I'm a softie, so I won't say anything about your blunt 'strine way of saying it. What one puts into racing has a lot to do with what one wants to get out of it. If winning contests with other competitors and taking home the trophies for first place is what you want, You're not likely to do it in any street legal car that is also legal by the racing association rules. I'll guarantee that the winners are neither rule-legal nor street-legal. Bet my billions on it, I would. If you are in it for the thrill and pleasure of doing the best you can with what you got, success is guaranteed, if you actually have that desire and actually do bump up against the limits of your machinery and skill resources. Doing either, today, will cost a great deal more and require a great deal more time, dedication, and reasearch than it did in the day when I did it. I'm bumping up against the limits of my budget and skills right now, trying to get a satisfactory experience autocrossing my 2006 Ford Mustang V6 "truck" (probably 3450 LBS all-up). But I'm making progress, and it steers neutral and flat, offers up over- or under-steer on request, predictably and with a good sense of car control. But it's still 5% slower than /real/ slalom cars in the same or similar classes. I love the old cars. I owned and over-used quite a number in the day, drove and appreciated many more, and am still delighted to see them around. There is nothing to compare to /my/ sense of what an early XKE coupe (or MG TC, or 2-spare Morgan, or even [on one occasion in Hollywood] a Humber Super Snipe) does to my internal landscape, when I run across one in the wild. What a sunny, light, enlightened aura inhabits my person for a while! Marvelous. As for MGs, I like them all; I have been in love with the Bs since they arrived. Especially the B/GT. Something about the economy of shape and the articulation of detail does it for me. Same for the Morris Minor Traveller. Something there that rings a bell, strikes a chord, tingles my tingler. Just for fun, let me list cars I have known, owned, enjoyed and loved (or not): (in the order I had them, more or less) - s = slalomed in organized association (what they call "autocross" or "Solo II" these days) and they won some trophies, a couple of championships*, and were all street legal. - r = raced in organized association and they won some trophies and were all street legal. 1949 Ford Tudor flathead 6 1949 Buick Super 4-door 1953 MG TD - s 1953 Ford Convertible flathead V8 1955 Olds 88 4-door sedan 1955 Austin-Healey 100 1960 Austin-Healey 3000 4-seater - s 1959 Austin-Healey Sprite 1960 Morris Minor 1000 Traveller 1966 Plymouth Barracuda Formula S - s 1967 MGB/GT - s - r 1967 MGB Tourer - s - r 1967 Dodge Dart 2-door hardtop 1967 VW Westfalia camper van 1966 Lotus Elan S2 roadster - s* 1965 Chevrolet Corvair Corsa Convertible 1963 Plymouth Valiant 2-door sedan 1956 Buick Super 2-door hardtop 1971 Chevrolet Vega Kammback - s - r 1972 Chevrolet Vega GT coupe - s* - r 1973 Chevrolet Vega GT Kammback 1974 Chevrolet Vega GT Kammback 1974 Chevrolet G20 Beauville 11-passenger van 1968 Plymouth Satellite 2-door hardtop 1976 Datsun King Cab pickup 1962 Ford Falcon Ranchero 1979 Triumph TR7 convertible - s 1978 Datsun Chinook camper 1985 Honda Civic LX 1989 Toyota Extended Cab SR5 pickup - s 2000 Honda CRV 2004 Toyota RAV4 2006 Ford Mustang convertible - s (may have missed a couple) Which one would I want back? No hesitation: the Elan. Great, great car. Tiny, comfy, powerful, unique - until Mr Mazda bought the best one he could find, disassembled and reassembled it and made a modern version with all the right technology: the MX5 Miata. Great in its own right. My daughter and son-in-law campaigned one for a few years; daughter made it to the National Runoffs as a hired gun in someone else's more modified car. They just bought another, older one for my granddaughter to learn the autocross skills in. Just to keep somewhere near the photo theme of this group: MG TD photographed in dawn light along Route 66, 1958 or so, Argus C3, Kodachrome http://home.san.rr.com/fsheff/pictures/mgroad2s.jpg Gong the other way, two years later, Voightlander Vitessa, Tri-X http://home.san.rr.com/fsheff/pictures/mghwyjbs.jpg Exit of Turn Seven, Riverside International Raceway, 1968, photo on Agfa by Bill Bean, unknown camera http://home.san.rr.com/fsheff/pictures/mgrir02.jpg In Turn 4, Playas de Tijuana races, 1968, unk camera, unk film, Vern Jaques photo http://home.san.rr.com/fsheff/pictures/mgbtjrr3.jpg Any road, it was all good, and still can be done with a street legal car, if your reward system is mostly intrinsic. SignatureFrank ess > Doing either, today, will cost a great deal more and require a great > deal more time, dedication, and reasearch than it did in the day when [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > control. But it's still 5% slower than /real/ slalom cars in the same > or similar classes. Mustangs are probably the worst handling cars ever built even after having the suspension totally reworked. You should have considered an early 90s Chevy S10 with the 4.3. These trucks are Mustang killers straight line or slalom. Rita >>> Yes....Glad to hear you calling it, "Motor racing". Automobile >>> racing it isn't. Not if you can go down to your local dealer and buy [quoted text clipped - 54 lines] > not): > (in the order I had them, more or less) I had a friend that owned a Fiat "Abarth" (muffler system) and drove it to work all week, and raced it on weekends....He would tape a cardboard "fin" to the trunk lid, and race it in the two modification class, as well as the single mod class, and sometimes he would win both races! Another great car that appeared much later was the Datson 240 Z.....The guys who lived across the street from me bought three of them. I also remember the Sunbeam, "Alpine".....Another great GB sports car....... "Frank ess" <frank@fshe2fs.com> wrote in message http://home.san.rr.com/fsheff/pictures/mgbtjrr3.jpg > Any road, it was all good, and still can be done with a street legal car, > if your reward system is mostly intrinsic. Now, that's the kind of racing I remember.....Those cars' only modifications were the roll bar, good competition seat harnesses, and (perhaps) a scatter shield around the clutch......Otherwise they were just like what people drove to work all week. > Now, that's the kind of racing I remember.....Those cars' only modifications > were the roll bar, good competition seat harnesses, and (perhaps) a scatter > shield around the clutch......Otherwise they were just like what people > drove to work all week. Which is pretty much exactly what the street classes are today in most cases. MrT. > I love the old cars. I owned and over-used quite a number in the day, > drove and appreciated many more, and am still delighted to see them > around. There is nothing to compare to /my/ sense of what an early XKE > coupe (or MG... Here's a private comment I got on the MG pic: > Paul, when I got back from Vietnam I bought a fully restored '59 Ghia convertible for $550. It was the absolute coolest car I have ever owned. After two accidents I sold it to my brother who was a student at .... Last I heard was it was collecting rainwater in a farmers field > What one puts into racing has a lot to do with what one wants to get > out of it. If winning contests with other competitors and taking home > the trophies for first place is what you want, You're not likely to do > it in any street legal car that is also legal by the racing > association rules. I'll guarantee that the winners are neither > rule-legal nor street-legal. Bet my billions on it, I would. Well that obviously depends on the race regs, organisers, scrutineers, governing body etc. etc. And of course the same could be said 50 years ago. <snip> > Which one would I want back? No hesitation: the Elan. Great, great > car. Tiny, comfy, powerful, unique - until Mr Mazda bought the best > one he could find, disassembled and reassembled it and made a modern > version with all the right technology: the MX5 Miata. Great in its own > right. Which was my point. I once owned a Lotus too, and yet the Miata is better built, more powerful, more reliable, and cheaper in real terms than the old Lotus. While I am still a Lotus fan, I am quite capable of separating nostalgia from reality. Even the new Lotus's are better cars, just as one has every right to expect from improved technology. I'd be much more amazed if technology really had gone backward, as some here seem to think. MrT. >>> If you don't think there are FAR better sports cars available these >>> days than the old MG's, then nostalgia has simply warped your brain. [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > California license plate "FLICK U". (You could have the car, the plate, > and all the spares for just $15,000.) Yeah? Right after I finish the two B roadsters lingering in my basement ... >> If you don't think there are FAR better sports cars available these days >> than the old MG's, then nostalgia has simply warped your brain. > > Nothing that's more just plain unadulterated *FUN* though. And a properly > tuned old MG probably gets better gas mileage. Well, I just happened to own an MG, but there were dozens of nice two seaters to choose from in my day.....Austin Healey's, Morgan's, Triumphs, Jags and Porsche's.......Too many to mention in all price ranges....Today, you can buy any two seater you want, as long as it's a Mazda Miata......(I think Pontiac makes a competitor to the Miata, too, but I forget its designation) > Well, I just happened to own an MG, but there were dozens of nice two > seaters to choose from in my day.....Austin Healey's, Morgan's, Triumphs, > Jags and Porsche's.......Too many to mention in all price ranges....Today, > you can buy any two seater you want, as long as it's a Mazda Miata......(I > think Pontiac makes a competitor to the Miata, too, but I forget its > designation) Not to mention all the others that you don't mention :-) Hell England still makes plenty of two seater sports cars, so does Italy, and Japan still makes a lot more than the Mazda (even if the Honda NSX is now gone) In fact allowing for inflation, none of the cars you mention was in the same price class as the Mazda anyway. And the Mazda is simply a better made, better performing, more reliable, cheaper copy of the Lotus Elan. Which accounts for why it has sold hundreds of times the amount of any of the pommy cars you mention. Of course because so many people have actually bought one, the used value to those who are simply collectors rather than drivers, is not so great. MrT. >> Well, I just happened to own an MG, but there were dozens of nice two >> seaters to choose from in my day.....Austin Healey's, Morgan's, Triumphs, [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > > MrT. Funny you should mention Lotus.....they made a car which was almost an exact copy (externally) of my MG-A......Beautiful car, with nothing you could touch while sitting in it except glass and glove leather....And, (of course) a bigger, more powerful engine. I sat in one at an auto show in SF back in the 70's......I have never seen one on the street, and I forget whether it was an Elite, or Elan, or something like that.......I'd give my eye teeth to own one, but I doubt if anyone makes anything as elegant today at any price........ > Funny you should mention Lotus.....they made a car which was almost an exact > copy (externally) of my MG-A......Beautiful car, with nothing you could > touch while sitting in it except glass and glove leather....And, (of course) > a bigger, more powerful engine. I sat in one at an auto show in SF back in > the 70's......I have never seen one on the street, and I forget whether it > was an Elite, or Elan, or something like that....... Possibly the Lotus super 7? >I'd give my eye teeth to own one, but I doubt if anyone makes anything as elegant today at any > price........ In fact there are still makers (not Lotus) who make almost identical versions of the Seven to this day. Caterham owns the rights to the original design. http://www.caterham.co.uk Then there are cars like the Morgan which are still VERY similar in style and finish, albeit more powerful, faster and more expensive. So it's amazing how those most caught up with nostalgia don't even realise what is currently available. MrT. >> Funny you should mention Lotus.....they made a car which was almost an > exact [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > MrT. Yes.....I do like the Morgan. - I almost bought one back in the early 1980's. A friend of mine went to England, and was going to purchase it and ship it back for me. But the deal was too complicated, with inspections and all, and the friend was on business and just didn't have the time to bother with it, so it fell through. But it is one of my favorite cars.......No. It looks like it will either be a BMW, or a Miata for me, and although the Beamers are very nice, I like the looks of the Miata better....... >>>Well, I just happened to own an MG, but there were dozens of nice two >>>seaters to choose from in my day.....Austin Healey's, Morgan's, Triumphs, [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > Funny you should mention Lotus.....they made a car which was almost an exact > copy (externally) of my MG-A......Beautiful car, Can't recall the MGA looking anything like a Lotus Unless its a lotus which still dosen;t look like the MGA with nothing you could > touch while sitting in it except glass and glove leather....And, (of course) > a bigger, more powerful engine. The Lotus twin Cam motor? Now the MGA did come out with a twin cam also. I sat in one at an auto show in SF back in > the 70's......I have never seen one on the street, and I forget whether it > was an Elite, or Elan, or something like that.......I'd give my eye teeth to > own one, but I doubt if anyone makes anything as elegant today at any > price........ Now the price of the MGB was $2850 in 1967. This is my very early MGB 1962. http://tinyurl.com/2x54ed r >>>>Well, I just happened to own an MG, but there were dozens of nice two >>>>seaters to choose from in my day.....Austin Healey's, Morgan's, [quoted text clipped - 48 lines] > > r A beautiful car....I just preferred the swept down fender line of the "A" models. > Nothing that's more just plain unadulterated *FUN* though. Well "fun" is all the mind of the beholder. Personally I'd rather a Bugatti Veyron :-) >And a properly tuned old MG probably gets better gas mileage. Than a yank SUV? No doubt, but so what? MrT. >>Well, I compare that short of the restored Ghia to the ugly, boxy, SUV's I >> see advertised on the TV, and it looks beautiful to me...I can't believe [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > Lets see, you are comparing an old English sports car with new American > trucks, why? Because that's all they sell here in America....Trucks.....That's why. > If you don't think there are FAR better sports cars available these days > than the old MG's, then nostalgia has simply warped your brain. Not when you consider price, there aren't.....Sure, I can pay 50 grand for a new Corvette.....And there are a half dozen or so Japanese two seaters that are pretty.....(I love the Miata) But anything made in the US? - Forget it! But the sale > of sports cars has always been in the minority since they are impractical > for most people, regardless of cost. > > MrT. This last must be true....I have been looking for good ones all of my life....As soon as I started working and got my hands on a little money, the Brits stopped making them, and here in the US they never made them to begin with. Now, I am faced with spending a fortune to find and/or restore my own classic, or (and this is what I will do) buy a new Miata.....And the American manufacturers bemoan the fact that people are buying foreign....Well, what do they expect? They never did make what people wanted....They always made what they wanted to make, and then relied on Madison Avenue to convince the public to buy it.......It took the Japanese revolution to teach them to poll the public first, and then make what the public wanted....(If they've learned that even today) > > Lets see, you are comparing an old English sports car with new American > > trucks, why? > > Because that's all they sell here in America....Trucks.....That's why. What a load of crap. I think you would find Ferrari, Porsche, Aston Martin, Lotus, and dozens of other sports car makers would go broke without U.S. sales > > If you don't think there are FAR better sports cars available these days > > than the old MG's, then nostalgia has simply warped your brain. > > Not when you consider price, there aren't..... Allowing for inflation the Mazda MX5/Miatta is far better and cheaper than anything similar produced in the past. >Sure, I can pay 50 grand for a > new Corvette.....And there are a half dozen or so Japanese two seaters that > are pretty.....(I love the Miata) But anything made in the US? - Forget it! Who says it has to be made in the USA. You do realise the MG was not made in America right? > This last must be true....I have been looking for good ones all of my > life....As soon as I started working and got my hands on a little money, the > Brits stopped making them, and here in the US they never made them to begin > with. Now, I am faced with spending a fortune to find and/or restore my own > classic, or (and this is what I will do) buy a new Miata..... Which is a far better, cheaper, more reliable, copy of the Lotus Elan. I suggest the only reason you don't buy one is because there are too many on the road to be exclusive. It's amazing what people will put up with for exclusivity! >And the > American manufacturers bemoan the fact that people are buying [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > revolution to teach them to poll the public first, and then make what the > public wanted....(If they've learned that even today) In fact the US makers gave the public exactly what they wanted in most cases. It's the US public's total lack of taste and discrimination that is at fault. There are more people wanting Hummers than Ferrari's. In fact one of the worlds best sports cars is made in the USA, the Ford GT (both old and new versions), and how many were sold? MrT. >> > Lets see, you are comparing an old English sports car with new American >> > trucks, why? [quoted text clipped - 56 lines] > > MrT. If you think 3000 pounds of scrap iron is a "sports car" then the Ford GT is about what the American's want, all right.....To me, anything that weighs over 2000 lbs is a truck. And, everything they make (and advertise on TV) today at least looks like a truck, except they won't haul as much manure.......Sorry.....The era of the sports car ended with the demise of the Jag XK-E type back in the 70's.........Exactly why, I can't say, or at least, prove, but all I know is it's gone forever...... > If you think 3000 pounds of scrap iron is a "sports car" then the Ford GT is > about what the American's want, all right.....To me, anything that weighs [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > the Jag XK-E type back in the 70's.........Exactly why, I can't say, or at > least, prove, but all I know is it's gone forever...... Your entitled to your opinion I guess, but the new Ford GT is a FAR better car than the old E type. Hell the new Jaguar XK's are FAR better cars than the old E-Type! And if you really want the ultimate in performance and minimum weight, buy a sports motor bike instead! MrT. >> If you think 3000 pounds of scrap iron is a "sports car" then the Ford GT > is [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > MrT. You are correct there....I rode motorcycles all of my life.....I just sold my 1985 BMW K-100 a few months ago to a guy down the block. When it comes to bang for your buck, motorcycles are certainly the way to go......I am just getting too old for them.....I have been very lucky. I have put well over a quarter of a million miles on motorcycles in my lifetime without ever having a serious accident, so now I think I am wise to give them up...... > I thought Karman Ghia's were ugly back in the 50's, but by today's > standards, they are beautiful...... Yep, a bit like Studebakers and the classic Citroens... http://xs49.xs.to/pics/05404/Car1ValiantBsAs400.jpg (crap picture - but I just looove the styling on this Aussie Chrysler Valiant designed by Studebaker!) http://www.collectorcarbuff.com/collector/9_53_studebaker.jpg http://www.misterw.com/Citroen/Citroen08b.jpg Images are not mine, just grabbed off Google Images with humblest apologies to their authors! Hope they work... >> I thought Karman Ghia's were ugly back in the 50's, but by today's >> standards, they are beautiful...... Back in the day (mid 60s) I knew a guy with a Carrera engine and racing tires in/on his Karmann Ghia VW coupe. When it was sitting still it was ugly. Once it began to move it was a real beauty. > Yep, a bit like Studebakers and the classic Citroens... > > http://xs49.xs.to/pics/05404/Car1ValiantBsAs400.jpg > (crap picture - but I just looove the styling on this Aussie > Chrysler > Valiant designed by Studebaker!) Back in the same day I knew a fellow with a 426 Hemi in his fugly Valiant sedan. Same story: sitting still it was hard to look at, in motion it radiated charisma. > http://www.collectorcarbuff.com/collector/9_53_studebaker.jpg > > http://www.misterw.com/Citroen/Citroen08b.jpg > > Images are not mine, just grabbed off Google Images with humblest > apologies to their authors! Hope they work... Yup. SignatureFrank S Recommending: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB117702894815776259.html For your enjoyment and edification |
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