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Photo Forum / General Photo Topics / Australian Photography / December 2006

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Mickey Mouse - 04 Dec 2006 07:06 GMT
I'm using Halogen flood lighting in my makeshift living room/studio.

I want to buy a filter for my lens to compensate for the orange caste
created by this lighting.  What color filter should I use to begin with?
I also use PSP but prefer to correct the color when shooting.

Mickey
Duncan - 04 Dec 2006 07:54 GMT
Tricky question as each lamp will start with a colour temperature and as it
ages shifts to red.

You could ask the manufactures but the only real way is to use a colour
temperature meter to get the right balance with these lights. I've found
they vary from 2,800k to 3,200k.

As a starting point an 80a or b should solve most of the problems although
these are in Photoshop in CS2. But I agree with you filtering the original
is better.

Duncan

> I'm using Halogen flood lighting in my makeshift living room/studio.
>
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
> Mickey
Rob - 04 Dec 2006 08:46 GMT
> Tricky question as each lamp will start with a colour temperature and as it
> ages shifts to red.
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
> Duncan

And when you try the blue filters there is still some cast. Have known
to double up the a + b  as they still filter a spectrum. there are 4 in
the 80 range abcd and its interesting to look at the graphs of each.

If you can get hold of it:

Handbook of Kodak Photographic Filters
B3
Cat No. 152 8108
ISBN 0-87985-658-0

This will explain a great deal of what you want to know and give you an
understanding.

>>I'm using Halogen flood lighting in my makeshift living room/studio.
>>
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>>
>>Mickey
Mickey Mouse - 04 Dec 2006 09:09 GMT
Thanks Duncan & Rob, advice noted and will be taken.  BTW,  there is so much
complaining about PSP XI that I'm thinking about trialling CS2.  Have you
any objective opinions about this or am I considering the frying pan or fire
scenario.

Mickey

>> Tricky question as each lamp will start with a colour temperature and as
>> it ages shifts to red.
[quoted text clipped - 30 lines]
>>>
>>>Mickey
Rob - 04 Dec 2006 09:38 GMT
> Thanks Duncan & Rob, advice noted and will be taken.  BTW,  there is so
> much complaining about PSP XI that I'm thinking about trialling CS2.  
> Have you any objective opinions about this or am I considering the
> frying pan or fire scenario.
>
> Mickey

PSP is not all that good. Its cheap and small compared to CS2.  I use CS2.

I would suggest having a look at  Adobe Lightroom its in the beta stages
 but looking good, its a free download at present. Compact size. About
8Mb download.

http://labs.adobe.com/technologies/lightroom/
Duncan - 04 Dec 2006 13:12 GMT
CS2 without doubt.

Using anything lightweight in ability will seriously affect what is possible
with image editing and manipulation.

It is a frying pan if you are staring out with it. Big programme and a
reasonable learning curve. I've used it from v2 and I'm still learning!

Duncan

> Thanks Duncan & Rob, advice noted and will be taken.  BTW,  there is so
> much complaining about PSP XI that I'm thinking about trialling CS2.  Have
[quoted text clipped - 37 lines]
>>>>
>>>>Mickey
Duncan - 04 Dec 2006 15:16 GMT
I should have asked before but what type of halogen are you using?

FWIW I made some tests on the domestic halogens around the house with my
colour meter and they came out around the 2,700k to 2,885k.

Duncan
Mickey Mouse - 04 Dec 2006 20:59 GMT
Duncan, I'm afraid I don't have a colour meter.  Your seem more technically
minded than me.  Only information I can give is that I'm using...
One Halogen main flood 500W, 7500 Lumen, 1000h and
One Halogen side light 200W, ?Lumen
One overhead Halogen 50w (for highlighting hair)
These floods are the type more suited for lighting up for a backyard BBQ
(lol), I know this is not ideal but is all I have.  They are good enough for
me as I can adjust for caste in PSP, however simulating natural light would
be as you know more pleasing, that's why I'm asking about filters.
These floodlights appear to be too strong though as I don't get the
shadowing on the subject that I'm looking for.  Using less powerful lighting
may produce the desired results but then requires me to use a tripod at a
slower shutter speed and this exposure exposes me to subject movement.
Nevertheless, what I do is for me and it's a great hobby.

Mickey

>I should have asked before but what type of halogen are you using?
>
> FWIW I made some tests on the domestic halogens around the house with my
> colour meter and they came out around the 2,700k to 2,885k.
>
> Duncan
Duncan - 05 Dec 2006 09:11 GMT
No justification necessary Mickey.

Use what you have as I too use builders lights, (2 tripod mounted halogens
with 2 x 500w lamps on each) for some studio product shots. Works fine for
what I want. But if you're looking for shadows what effect are you trying to
achieve?
Any examples you could refer to?

You could put an in-line dimmer on the lights and see if that gives you more
control and the colour shift will warm slightly. Digitally speaking taking a
white balance in these lights should render a usable shot with minimal work
afterwards.

Yes I use a Minolta Colour Meter II that I picked up relatively cheaply
otherwise it would have been a luxury. Nice to have at the right price
though.

What I'd do is a test run with a 36 exposure roll and get your nearest
available person to pose for you for an hour, buy them lunch if you have to.
Take a controlled set of images without filtration and then bracket. Then on
successive shots add what filters you have in the 80 range combining them as
well so you cover the permutations of what you have.
Have this process only and then see what works for the filtration. It will
be heaps less than buying a meter and will give you a reference point for
future exposures.Any slights casts can be then dialled out with an image
editing programme.

As for control why not make yourself some barn doors with some wire coat
hangers to forme around the lights and some flattened out tin cans that you
can glue together to make larger and then paint with matt black. Snip a few
notches in them and wrap these around the wire forme. Hey presto barn doors.

Good Luck

Duncan

> Duncan, I'm afraid I don't have a colour meter.  Your seem more
> technically minded than me.  Only information I can give is that I'm
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
>>
>> Duncan
Mickey Mouse - 07 Dec 2006 00:50 GMT
Builders lights????  Wire coat hanger, tin cans????
Way to go Duncan!!!  lol

I'm learning to take portraits of my friends and I'd really like to achieve
the kind of shots like you see in magazines.  The type of portrait were say
the left side of the face has a very good tonal range and the right side of
the face is in a deep but not too deep shadow, which is not happening.
I suspect my lighting is too strong and I could achieve my effect using say
only one light but this would reduce my shutter speed considerably.  Your
suggestion of a dimmer control is so obvious that I didn't think of it,
thanks.
What I really want to do is hand hold without a tripod which for me requires
at least a shutter speed of 125 on 200 iso
Looks like I need some kind of meter, coat hangers and tin cans, I'll get to
it!
lol lol.  Glad I met you!!

Mickey

> No justification necessary Mickey.
>
[quoted text clipped - 58 lines]
>>>
>>> Duncan
Duncan - 07 Dec 2006 07:00 GMT
No worries Mickey good to have a constructive conversation and to have a
creative person here. Too much technicality and not enough basics makes me
cringe. I visited a photographic club about 5 years ago and technically they
were superb but creatively they were as dull as watching damp toast.
Although by today's standards damp toast could win a major prize in the art
world.

My philosophy is buy the best you can't afford - but then I love to tinker
around with all sorts of common place items to get the shot. Any examples of
what shots you are describing? A link would be good so I can get a better
impression of what you are after. Magazine shots are fairly standard and are
usually two light set-ups with softboxes and a key light just to throw a
touch of shadow. Though it's more like a digital sausage machine today.

Cheap soft box is to have a directional light bounce off of a large sheet of
polystyrene that they use for filling in walls with. lol

Back to the builders yard again!

If you don't want to use a tripod you don't have to but think of using
monopod instead. These can be a lot more useful and keeps the fluidity
going. But a quick release on tripod or monopod would also help.

Light is one thing but it isn't just about the lights. Having reflectors
both white and black to kill the reflections are just as important. Art
board from an art shop is a cheap and effective as reflectors and also
double up as useful backgrounds for still life. And when you're bored you
can use them as a wobble board and do a Rolf Harris impression!!!

Even mirrors can be useful to bounce around light from just one source and
the old friend the inverse square law will help soften as it goes.
I may be wrong but was it Lattigan who say he only used one light as the big
guy [meaning God] does?

Shielding the camera with material to stop reflections of yourself being in
shot is important when highly reflective surfaces are in shot. And the
material can be used to push lighting through it to give a soft effect.

I've used my Carousel projector as a light source and used all sorts of
objects like the tin can examples to make what I need. In fact today my
project is to make a light brush. Hensel make a fabulous light brush by it's
expensive. So I'm off to my local electrics shop to find a low voltage light
source and some fibre optic to make one. I've a budget of around AUD50 as I
have transformers and other bits to piece it together. e.g. tin can tube and
some gaffer tape.

One source of amusement to some friends is that I admit to watching Art
Programme for children. It's great seeing how inventive these people are
making it easy for kids to do. BUT the big one is that I remember all sorts
of stuff from my younger days and I delight in remembering all the basic
stuff I forgot when I got technical! But it's a real buzz since they make me
think about shots and ideas I can make up for my projects.

Happy to continue this conversation by email if you like Mickey.

Duncan

> Builders lights????  Wire coat hanger, tin cans????
> Way to go Duncan!!!  lol
[quoted text clipped - 79 lines]
>>>>
>>>> Duncan
Rob - 07 Dec 2006 20:43 GMT
> Builders lights????  Wire coat hanger, tin cans????
> Way to go Duncan!!!  lol
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
>
> Mickey

Bits and Pieces

Contrast ratio its called and there are some basics to use to achieve
the end result.

If you want to hand hold your camera then a flash unit would be more
appropriate for the application.

A studio flash of about 500W/s is all you need for portraits.

Using one lamp and trying to direct tungsten lamps is difficult.

Have you tried using available light with a flash fill?  Placing a flash
off camera and bouncing out of a brolly.

Soft lighting can be achieved by pointing lights into the
corners/ceiling of a room.
 
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