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Photo Forum / Film Photography / 35 mm / February 2005

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[SI] Is the SI still alive?

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Graham Fountain - 26 Feb 2005 08:21 GMT
Just wondering if the SI is still alive?? looking at
http://www.aliasimages.com/si/rulz.html the current mandate (Symmetry) which
is due this weekend hasn't appeared on there yet. As I write this it is now
saturday evening and there still isn't a mandate for the coming fortnight.
Please tell me that the SI isn't in it's death throws.  Unfortunately, I
haven't been able to participate since reflections - between some camera
hiccups, and the busiest time of the year for us poor souls in retail, I
haven't had much chance to get out with the camera. I did manage to get a
shot for symmetry though.
Al Denelsbeck - 26 Feb 2005 11:56 GMT
> Just wondering if the SI is still alive?? looking at
> http://www.aliasimages.com/si/rulz.html the current mandate (Symmetry)
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> year for us poor souls in retail, I haven't had much chance to get out
> with the camera. I did manage to get a shot for symmetry though.

       Still here, as long as people are contributing ;-)

       Symmetry is due tomorrow, and doesn't go up until the evening EDT -
most of the submissions are here by then.

       As for the next mandate, well, there's only so much I can do to
remind people. After a certain wait, the next in line is asked to jump in.

       While hardly fair, the SI has been roughly on the timeframe of
Eastern to Central time, US - the majority of participants consider those
local times, and too many submit right at deadline. And then, a few more
just blow the deadline all to hell ;-)

       As for contributions, I think a lot of people found themselves in the
same boat as you - just too busy to get something right now. My own time
and energy has been taken up the past couple of months, so contributions
have been rushed and commentary nonexistent. I keep swearing this will
change...

       But anyway, don't leave it up to everyone else - jump in! Send in
your symmetry shot - I have seven others waiting on Sunday night, and we're
not even close to deadline yet;-). And fire off some comments, even if
they're totally frivolous. I have yet to see someone do a really
pretentious art critic style...

       Have fun!

    - Al.

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Graham Fountain - 26 Feb 2005 12:06 GMT
>    But anyway, don't leave it up to everyone else - jump in! Send in
> your symmetry shot - I have seven others waiting on Sunday night, and
> we're
> not even close to deadline yet;-).
I sent mine in last monday from memory. Hopefully it is amongst the 7 you
already have. If not let me know and I'll send it again.
Glad to hear the SI is alive and hopefully well.
Walt Hanks - 26 Feb 2005 12:22 GMT
> I sent mine in last monday from memory. Hopefully it is amongst the 7 you
> already have. If not let me know and I'll send it again.
> Glad to hear the SI is alive and hopefully well.

Al sends an autoreply when he receives each entry.  So if you didn't receive
a reply, he probably didn't receive it.

I look forward to seeing your entry.

Walt
Alan Browne - 26 Feb 2005 19:13 GMT
> Just wondering if the SI is still alive?? looking at
> http://www.aliasimages.com/si/rulz.html the current mandate (Symmetry) which
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> haven't had much chance to get out with the camera. I did manage to get a
> shot for symmetry though.

It's alive if in the winter doldrums.  Current mandate should be posted tomorrow.

Cheers,
Alan

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TAFKAB - 26 Feb 2005 20:14 GMT
>> Just wondering if the SI is still alive?? looking at
>> http://www.aliasimages.com/si/rulz.html the current mandate (Symmetry)
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> It's alive if in the winter doldrums.  Current mandate should be posted
> tomorrow.

Greetings! I just returned from the northland (maybe the southland to you)
and can't wait to see the symmetry shots. I trust you have a good one. I
plan to review them Monday night.

> Cheers,
> Alan
Alan Browne - 27 Feb 2005 15:30 GMT
Oops.  I was hinting at you to post a mandate!

Al, if you have an e-mail for Steely Dan, can you throw him a reminder?  It's
his turn.

Cheers,
Alan

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jimkramer - 27 Feb 2005 15:38 GMT
> Oops.  I was hinting at you to post a mandate!
>
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> Cheers,
> Alan

Time for someone else to call the tune.  Steelydan hasn't posted in a long
time.

Jim Kramer
Graham Fountain - 26 Feb 2005 21:34 GMT
> It's alive if in the winter doldrums.  Current mandate should be posted
> tomorrow.
Since most of you live in areas that would be snow covered, I would have
thought that would give all sorts of potential for photography - lovely long
shadows any time of day, plenty of snow and ice, it'd be a photogs dream I
would imagine.  Here, winter is chilly, but no snow. Where I live is one of
the cooler areas in the state due to our altitude, but we still only get
maybe a dozen frosty mornings a year. By 8am most of the frost is gone.
Here I've been putting up with raging hot summer.  Our summer sun is almost
directly overhead during the middle of the day, giving an extremely harsh
horrible lighting. It is ok for closeup flower shots and the like - there is
so much light you can get away with handholding at small apertures.  The
other headache here in summer, is that it is our wet season, so most
afternoons instead of being able to revel in that nice golden sunlight, we
instead have lots of dull grays as the rain buckets down.  The final
drawback to summer - since water comes out of the tap at about 30 degrees C,
processing B&W becomes a pain trying to keep the stuff cool - I end up
having to use heaps of ice to get the water down to 20C, but I find it quite
tricky trying to maintain an accurate temperature. The upside is, c41 & e6
work becomes easy - when the room temp is in the mid 30's, it's quite easy
to maintain 38C in the bath.

> Cheers,
> Alan
Alan Browne - 27 Feb 2005 15:47 GMT
>>It's alive if in the winter doldrums.  Current mandate should be posted
>>tomorrow.
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> would imagine.  Here, winter is chilly, but no snow. Where I live is one of
> the cooler areas in the state due to our altitude, but we still only get

I was out shooting yesterday and last week in great magic hour light creating
deep blues in shaddows, golden light on the snow, etc.  Yesterday, efter 10
frames near a windblown lake I had to give up ... my hands were frozen...

> maybe a dozen frosty mornings a year. By 8am most of the frost is gone.
> Here I've been putting up with raging hot summer.  Our summer sun is almost
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> work becomes easy - when the room temp is in the mid 30's, it's quite easy
> to maintain 38C in the bath.

After a creful review of C-41 and E-6 processing requirements I decided that the
local processors do fine job...

Cheers,
Alan.

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Bandicoot - 27 Feb 2005 18:51 GMT
> >>It's alive if in the winter doldrums.  Current mandate should be posted
> >>tomorrow.
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> deep blues in shaddows, golden light on the snow, etc.  Yesterday, efter 10
> frames near a windblown lake I had to give up ... my hands were frozen...

It keeps snowing here, but then the light is completely flat under dull grey
skies.  Then the snow melts.  _Then_  the sun comes out.  Then is only snows
again once the sun has gone.

Been shooting indoors instead.  One daylight shot of a pot containing three
hyacinths I planned for yesterday I didn't have enough sun for all day.
Today I had the sun, but one of the hyacinths had decided to grow at a funny
angle overnight.  Very frustrating!  At least I got a shot of them a day or
two before on 6x9, but I wanted one on 4x5 to make a large poster from.  6x9
will do a pretty big print, but not the wall-filling exhibition poster I had
in mind.  Oh well, teach me to be cheap and only grow one pot of the
hyacinth bulbs.

Peter
Alan Browne - 27 Feb 2005 19:13 GMT
> Today I had the sun, but one of the hyacinths had decided to grow at a funny
> angle overnight.  Very frustrating!  At least I got a shot of them a day or
> two before on 6x9, but I wanted one on 4x5 to make a large poster from.  6x9

is that 120 film?

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Bandicoot - 28 Feb 2005 01:33 GMT
> > Today I had the sun, but one of the hyacinths had decided to grow at a
> > funny angle overnight.  Very frustrating!  At least I got a shot of them
a day
> > or two before on 6x9, but I wanted one on 4x5 to make a large poster
> > from.  6x9
>
> is that 120 film?

Yes, so I suppose technically OT for this group ;-)

Horseman RFBs with Velvia 100F and Ilford Delta 400, on Arca-Swiss 6x9, with
a 150mm f9 Apo-Ronar, my preferred lens for close work on this format.  But,
just to be almost on topic, I did use the same light meter and tripod as I
use for a lot of my 35mm work...

Peter
Alan Browne - 28 Feb 2005 15:51 GMT
>>>Today I had the sun, but one of the hyacinths had decided to grow at a
>>>funny angle overnight.  Very frustrating!  At least I got a shot of them
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
> just to be almost on topic, I did use the same light meter and tripod as I
> use for a lot of my 35mm work...

Last fall I rented a 500CM and 150mm f/4.  Beautiful.  I used my incident meter
for most close work, and my Maxxum 9's spot meter for other situations and
backlight.  Velvia 50, E100VS were the main films.

I've been tempted to rent a 4x5 horseman as well, but so far I've held back.

Velvia 100 (sans "F") is coming this summer.

Cheers,
Alan

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Bandicoot - 28 Feb 2005 18:48 GMT
> >>>Today I had the sun, but one of the hyacinths had decided to grow at
> >>>a funny angle overnight.  Very frustrating!  At least I got a shot of
them
> >>>a day or two before on 6x9, but I wanted one on 4x5 to make a large
> >>>poster from.  6x9
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> meter for most close work, and my Maxxum 9's spot meter for other
> situations and backlight.  Velvia 50, E100VS were the main films.

150mm is a nice focal length on 6x6-7-8-9, I have a Schneider Tele-Xenar for
my 6x6 SLR, and use a Schneider Symmar-S on the 6x9 cameras that I use for
the rectangular formats, as well as the Apo-Ronar that works for closer
stuff.  It's a good moderate wideangle for 4x5 as well, and I use it on 6x12
and 6x17 as well.  (What with the Pentax 150mm I have for 35mm work, all
round it's a focal length I seem to get a lot of use from, for very
different things!)

For this sort of moderate close up work on medium format I tend to use
almost all incident metering too, whether the light is natural or flash.  I
have a 'mini receptor' - a meter cell on a flexible swan-neck - that I can
plug into my Sekonic and is useful for real close work.  And I usually
spot-meter for anything more distant.  Once one is taking the time and
trouble to use MF, it seems pointless not also to take care about exposure
and contrast too, after all.

> I've been tempted to rent a 4x5 horseman as well, but so far I've held
> back.

Give it a try.  Renting definitely makes sense as it is such a different way
of working that you may find it just doesn't suit you, so rent before you
think about buying.  That will also help you to work out whether you want a
field or a monorail camera, how much you will actually use movements, and so
on.  Now is certainly a cheap time to buy used if you find you do like it.

I don't actually shoot a huge amount of 4x5, but it is nice to make the
ocassional really large print (I have an old 5x7 too, but almost never use
it).  I use roll film backs much more often: up to 6x9 on my 6x9s (a
monorail and a technical camera) and up to 6x12 on my 4x5s (a monorail and a
stand mounted copy camera) - and more recently up to 6x17 on the 4x5 via a
back I recently bought to experiment with.  (Yes, 17cm is bigger than 5" - I
posted a review on RPEL-F a while back that explains what the trick is.)

I do like the movements for MF studio work, and of course they are a
necessity for much architectural work.  DoF is so shallow on 4x5 that they
become necessary for many shots that on smaller formats you wouldn't even
think of movements.

Anyway, RPEL-F is a good place to ask about this stuff.  Note that
'everyone' will tell you that a 4x5 camera is scarcely bigger than a 6x9 so
it isn't worth getting the latter.  As you will gather from the above, I
disagree!  My two monorails are both Arca-Swiss, and the 6x9 is  _much_
smaller and more portable.  The difference is less acute with field cameras,
but even so, I wouldn't suggest getting a 4x5 unless you actually need the
extra film acreage, either to shoot 4x5 sheets or to use a 6x12 back.

Definitely worth the cost of a rental or two to try it out.

> Velvia 100 (sans "F") is coming this summer.

Mmmm, Velvia....  ;-)

Peter
Sander Vesik - 28 Feb 2005 16:16 GMT
> > Today I had the sun, but one of the hyacinths had decided to grow at a funny
> > angle overnight.  Very frustrating!  At least I got a shot of them a day or
> > two before on 6x9, but I wanted one on 4x5 to make a large poster from.  6x9
>
> is that 120 film?

could be 220 film ;-)

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    Sander

+++ Out of cheese error +++

Bob Hickey - 28 Feb 2005 00:32 GMT
> Been shooting indoors instead.  One daylight shot of a pot containing three
> hyacinths I planned for yesterday I didn't have enough sun for all day.
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>
> Peter
                      With some flowers, you can put a light in the
direction you want them to grow, and the next day, they're facing the llight
bulb.                   Bob Hickey
Bandicoot - 28 Feb 2005 01:36 GMT
> > Been shooting indoors instead.  One daylight shot of a pot containing
> three
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
> direction you want them to grow, and the next day, they're facing the llight
> bulb.                   Bob Hickey

I'd been turning the pot ninety degrees each day to keep them straight, but
to no avail.  Am trying the light now to see if it straightens, but I don't
think Hyacinths are as cooperative as some others...

Peter
Bandicoot - 28 Feb 2005 18:52 GMT
[SNIP]
> >                        With some flowers, you can put a light in the
> > direction you want them to grow, and the next day, they're facing the
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> to no avail.  Am trying the light now to see if it straightens, but I don't
> think Hyacinths are as cooperative as some others...

Well, today they were wonkier than ever.  Oh well, the vertical composition
I had in mind was definitely out - so I shot a horizontal on 6x12 instead,
with the pot well to one side of the frame and the most strongly leaning of
the stems 'pointing' over into a large mass of empty space on the other
side.  On the GG I was quite pleased with the composition, even though it
was very different to what I had first envisaged.  Will have to see how the
slide looks.

Peter
Graham Fountain - 27 Feb 2005 22:01 GMT
>> having to use heaps of ice to get the water down to 20C, but I find it
>> quite tricky trying to maintain an accurate temperature. The upside is,
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> After a creful review of C-41 and E-6 processing requirements I decided
> that the local processors do fine job...
Using the kits (I use agfa for C41 & paterson for E6), it is not real hard.
Just get your temps up, and from there it is no harder than B&W, just a
little more time consuming. My motive for doing my own E6 is that there are
no local processors - it has to be sent to Sydney with a 3 week turnaround,
and costs a small fortune.  My motive for doing C41, was that after trying
most of the local labs (except the ones that charge $20), I kept getting
scratched negatives. The excuse was always that I must have dust in the
camera. Funny that I haven't had any scratches since I started doing it
myself. Perhaps it is caused by a problem in my process, but the C41 I do
myself has punchier colours than the commercially developed stuff too.

> Cheers,
> Alan.
Alan Browne - 27 Feb 2005 22:38 GMT
>>>having to use heaps of ice to get the water down to 20C, but I find it
>>>quite tricky trying to maintain an accurate temperature. The upside is,
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
> myself. Perhaps it is caused by a problem in my process, but the C41 I do
> myself has punchier colours than the commercially developed stuff too.

As long as I have two E-6 places within 20 minutes of my house (and a few more
in the city), that's no prob.  I have a lot of choice for color negative as well
and good quality, nominal price processing (even deep discounts at my regular gig).

Cheers,
Alan

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McLeod - 28 Feb 2005 23:17 GMT
>My motive for doing C41, was that after trying
>most of the local labs (except the ones that charge $20), I kept getting
>scratched negatives. The excuse was always that I must have dust in the
>camera. Funny that I haven't had any scratches since I started doing it
>myself. Perhaps it is caused by a problem in my process, but the C41 I do
>myself has punchier colours than the commercially developed stuff too.

Your scratches are being caused by poor maintenance procedures.  There
is only one usual place in a roller transport film processor to cause
scratches and that's right at the top of the tanks where the chemical
can oxidize on the rollers.  The manufacturers usually specify that
these get cleaned every day-I have been in a lot of places where no
daily maintenance is carried out.
As for punchier colours, a lot of the newer films have been designed
for C-41RA with very little agitation.  By hand processing you are
actually probably using C-41 and agitation which is causing a slight
push, or overprocessing.  If you prefer the punchier colour super, but
it could cause too much contrast in high contrast lighting situations
,like with studio strobes.
 
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