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Photo Forum / Film Photography / 35 mm / November 2006

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WHAT DEFINES ANY PARTICULAR MODEL OF A CAMERA "PROFESSIONAL"?

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helensilverburg@hotmail.com - 06 Nov 2006 11:44 GMT
I watched something very interesting on tv over the weekend.  I came in
the middle of the program so I didn't catch all of it.  But it raised
an interesting question:  What defines a professional camera?  The
people who were asked this question were photojournalists, professional
wedding photographers, magazine photographers, etc.  I'm just curious
what the pros on this NG have to say.  Thanks!
Regards,
Helen
Doug Payne - 06 Nov 2006 12:49 GMT
> What defines a professional camera?

The brain behind the viewfinder.
helensilverburg@hotmail.com - 06 Nov 2006 13:01 GMT
> > What defines a professional camera?
>
> The brain behind the viewfinder.

LOL.......Very true and well put!  :0)
Thanks,
Helen
jeremy - 06 Nov 2006 15:16 GMT
>> What defines a professional camera?
>
> The brain behind the viewfinder.

http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/great-camera.htm
helensilverburg@hotmail.com - 06 Nov 2006 15:28 GMT
> >> What defines a professional camera?
> >
> > The brain behind the viewfinder.
>
> http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/great-camera.htm

Very interesting article, Jeremy.  Thanks so much.
Helen
Chris Loffredo - 06 Nov 2006 16:14 GMT
>>> What defines a professional camera?
>> The brain behind the viewfinder.
>
> http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/great-camera.htm 

How sweet: It's Hero Worship...
Paul Furman - 06 Nov 2006 17:50 GMT
>>>> What defines a professional camera?
>>
>> http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/great-camera.htm
>
> How sweet: It's Hero Worship...

Rockwell can be a jerk but that article is mostly right on target.

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jeremy - 06 Nov 2006 19:12 GMT
>>>>> What defines a professional camera?
>>>
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
> Rockwell can be a jerk but that article is mostly right on target.

Lofredo can be such an a.shole at times!
Chris Loffredo - 06 Nov 2006 19:56 GMT
>>>>>> What defines a professional camera?
>>>> http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/great-camera.htm
>>> How sweet: It's Hero Worship...
>> Rockwell can be a jerk but that article is mostly right on target.
>
> Lofredo can be such an a.shole at times!

It's guaranteed if you keep quoting Ken Rockwell...
Scott W - 07 Nov 2006 00:52 GMT
> >> What defines a professional camera?
> >
> > The brain behind the viewfinder.
>
> http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/great-camera.htm

Ken seems to be shooting in jpeg mode as he seems pretty worried about
adjusting color as he shoots. If he would learn to shoot in raw mode he
could loose about half the adjustments he seems to think he needs.

Scott
Scott W - 07 Nov 2006 00:57 GMT
> > >> What defines a professional camera?
> > >
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>
> Scott

Ah yes here it is

from Kens web page

"I take a lot of flack from tweakers because I, like other
photographers, prefer to make my adjustments in-camera and use the JPGs
directly. Others prefer to spend even more time later twiddling in raw,
but that's not for me. I get the look I need with JPGs and prefer to
spend my time making more photos. If you're the sort of person who
likes to twiddle and redo than by all means raw is for you."

So the he feels a "good" camera should make it easy for him to keep
tweaking the color in the camera, even though you can't tell much of
anything from the cameras screen.  The guy really should learn a bit
more about raw and make the adjustment where they make sense, when you
can actually look at what the colors are going to look like.

Scott
Chris Loffredo - 07 Nov 2006 01:10 GMT
>>>>> What defines a professional camera?
>>>> The brain behind the viewfinder.
[quoted text clipped - 22 lines]
> more about raw and make the adjustment where they make sense, when you
> can actually look at what the colors are going to look like.

Three?
;-)
Scott W - 07 Nov 2006 01:12 GMT
> >>>>> What defines a professional camera?
> >>>> The brain behind the viewfinder.
[quoted text clipped - 25 lines]
> Three?
> ;-)
Are you referring to how many times we have agreed on anything?

Scott
Chris Loffredo - 07 Nov 2006 01:16 GMT
>>>>>>> What defines a professional camera?
>>>>>> The brain behind the viewfinder.
[quoted text clipped - 24 lines]
>> ;-)
> Are you referring to how many times we have agreed on anything?

Yup!
Paul Furman - 07 Nov 2006 16:08 GMT
>>>>>What defines a professional camera?
>>>>
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>>adjusting color as he shoots. If he would learn to shoot in raw mode he
>>could loose about half the adjustments he seems to think he needs.

I like RAW tweaking but this point is still valid for professional
quality it's still better to get exposure and WB correct in the field.
And pro reporters need to wire the jpegs swiftly to the agency... or may
use jpeg to speed up/lengthen burst mode.

> Ah yes here it is
>
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
>
> Scott

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jeremy - 07 Nov 2006 16:23 GMT
>Others prefer to spend even more time later twiddling in raw,
> but that's not for me. I get the look I need with JPGs and prefer to
> spend my time making more photos. If you're the sort of person who
> likes to twiddle and redo than by all means raw is for you."

He makes it clear that he is not being critical of those that prefer to
tweak RAW files.
Scott W - 07 Nov 2006 16:36 GMT
> >Others prefer to spend even more time later twiddling in raw,
> > but that's not for me. I get the look I need with JPGs and prefer to
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> He makes it clear that he is not being critical of those that prefer to
> tweak RAW files.

Sure he is being critical of of people who shoot raw, saying that he
would rather spend time shooting photos then tweaking raw images.  He
clearly does not know what he is talking about since it is far easy to
get the color right on your computer then in the camera.  He makes it
sound like if you shoot raw you have to adjust each photo on at a time,
you no more need to do this then change you camera setting between
every shoot.  I have to wonder if Ken has every used a decent raw
converter.

And the problem with Ken's workflow is you end up with photos that look
like this
http://www.kenrockwell.com/france/index.htm

Scott
Colin_D - 07 Nov 2006 22:29 GMT
>>> Others prefer to spend even more time later twiddling in raw,
>>> but that's not for me. I get the look I need with JPGs and prefer to
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> every shoot.  I have to wonder if Ken has every used a decent raw
> converter.

Reading between Ken's lines, by his saying "I get the look I need with
JPGs" he is saying that jpegs are good enough for him.  The essence for
him is to wire the images with little or no work before sending, which
he can't do with RAW images.  Even with an automatic converter like DxO,
it takes time - about 40 seconds per image from a 6MP camera on a 3.00
GHz computer - and longer on most laptops.

He appears to be denigratory of RAW users, the words 'twiddle' and
'redo' suggest he thinks they are somewhat anal about their images.
It's horses for courses.  His course is so-so images and much speed; my
course is as good an image as I can get.  Never the twain shall meet.

Colin D.

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Scott W - 07 Nov 2006 22:38 GMT
> >>> Others prefer to spend even more time later twiddling in raw,
> >>> but that's not for me. I get the look I need with JPGs and prefer to
[quoted text clipped - 25 lines]
>
> Colin D.

Here is the part that makes me think he really has no idea about what
he is doing, an item
he believes his camera must have.

"   Must include instant access to fine tuning (+/-). These trims are
critical to getting exactly the right look. You can get away without
trims if you have instant access to WB in degrees Kelvin. "

Now you have to ask how he is judging the effects of his on camera
color adjustments.  Is is trying to jugde by the screen on the back of
the camera.   Note he wasn "instant access" to the fine tuning which
would lead one to believe he is messing with this adjustment in the
field.

And of course looking at Ken's photos the colors don't look like
anything I see in real life, but then I never took acid.

Scott
Colin_D - 08 Nov 2006 00:39 GMT
>>>>> Others prefer to spend even more time later twiddling in raw,
>>>>> but that's not for me. I get the look I need with JPGs and prefer to
[quoted text clipped - 43 lines]
>
> Scott

Is he saying that WB is the only 'trim' he wants, and he wants some sort
of WB instant adjustment while he's shooting? he must have great faith
in his ability to judge WB on a camera screen with no reference
available.  And, as you say, the shots you provided the link to are way
off WB.  Say, maybe that's what he really wants - to be able to generate
these false colors in the camera by screwing with the WB, while we are
naively thinking he wants *accurate* WB.  You live and learn ...

Colin D.

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Scott W - 07 Nov 2006 16:26 GMT
> > I like RAW tweaking but this point is still valid for professional
> quality it's still better to get exposure and WB correct in the field.
> And pro reporters need to wire the jpegs swiftly to the agency... or may
> use jpeg to speed up/lengthen burst mode.

But a pro level camera has no problem with buffer depth when shooting
raw mode.

Scott
Kinon O'Cann - 06 Nov 2006 12:52 GMT
>I watched something very interesting on tv over the weekend.  I came in
> the middle of the program so I didn't catch all of it.  But it raised
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> Regards,
> Helen

Mostly depends on who's holding it.
helensilverburg@hotmail.com - 06 Nov 2006 12:56 GMT
> >I watched something very interesting on tv over the weekend.  I came in
> > the middle of the program so I didn't catch all of it.  But it raised
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>
> Mostly depends on who's holding it.

You know, a lot of the photographers said that same thing!  It's the
photographer not the camera. Thanks for your time.
Chris Loffredo - 06 Nov 2006 12:56 GMT
> I watched something very interesting on tv over the weekend.  I came in
> the middle of the program so I didn't catch all of it.  But it raised
> an interesting question:  What defines a professional camera?  The
> people who were asked this question were photojournalists, professional
> wedding photographers, magazine photographers, etc.  I'm just curious
> what the pros on this NG have to say.  Thanks!

Usually it's an emphasis on reliability and durability. In some cases
also flexibility.
helensilverburg@hotmail.com - 06 Nov 2006 12:59 GMT
> > I watched something very interesting on tv over the weekend.  I came in
> > the middle of the program so I didn't catch all of it.  But it raised
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> Usually it's an emphasis on reliability and durability. In some cases
> also flexibility.

Yes, there was a big emphasis on flexibility and durability.  A lot of
these guys go through "hell and high water" with their trusty cameras
and they need something very reliable.
Great point.  Thanks
Richard Polhill - 06 Nov 2006 13:37 GMT
> I watched something very interesting on tv over the weekend.  I came
> in the middle of the program so I didn't catch all of it.  But it
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> Regards,
> Helen

Some manufacturers seem to feel that stamping 'professional' on the side
of  their products imparts some sort of enhanced value. It always makes
me laugh; especially on a consumer item such as a television. Normally
seems to indicate the opposite.

I suppose whether an item - in this case a camera - could be regarded as
professional grade or as a professional tool really comes down to the
requirements of professionals.

Is the equipment capable of continuous daily use? Is it robust enough to
put up with the rigours of professional use without failure? Will
support, spares and service for it still be available for a sufficient
period for the initial investment to be repaid? Is it good enough?

To that end I know of several photographers that used Zenit cameras in
extreme locations because of their robustness, reliability, ability to
work in extreme conditions, and cheapness. They can afford to pack three
or four bodies for the price of one advanced camera, meaning that if one
gets lost or broken they can continue shooting. The M42 mount means they
can use Zeiss lenses also.

To that I can add that, typically, consumer grade products are built
down to a price, often adding features to compare favourably with other
items on the market at the same price. Professional grade equipment, on
the other hand, tends to be built UP to the price; it is made as good as
it can be without becoming prohibitively expensive. Then features can
often be bolted on if required rather than just adding to a long feature
list.

This is true for almost anything that constitutes a tool, used by
somebody for a living.

Amateurs often do not need such ruggedness and reliability - they are
not using it all day every day and their livelihood does not depend on
it - so can often choose more wisely than just buying the professional's
choice "cos it's the best."

What program was it, by the way?

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Geoffrey S. Mendelson - 06 Nov 2006 14:11 GMT
> Some manufacturers seem to feel that stamping 'professional' on the side
> of  their products imparts some sort of enhanced value. It always makes
> me laugh; especially on a consumer item such as a television. Normally
> seems to indicate the opposite.

It's also cultural. For example, in Japan, a professional camera does not
have a built in flash.

What always made me laugh was the term "prosumer". To me it meant too
expensive for consumers, not good enough for pros.

Geoff.
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TheDave© - 06 Nov 2006 18:33 GMT
> Geoffrey S. Mendelson wrote:
> What always made me laugh was the term "prosumer". To me it meant too
> expensive for consumers, not good enough for pros.

I always thought "prosumer" was an appeal to the snobbish amateur with
extra cash.
Nicholas O. Lindan - 06 Nov 2006 18:54 GMT
> "prosumer"

Doesn't really apply to photography since amateurs can/do
buy the same equipment professionals do.

It makes sense with video, where 'professional' cameras go for a
quarter million a pop.

The niche is video equipment that is 'good enough' for commercial
use but cheap enough that well healed dilettantes like to
muck about with it.  Schools and students are big buyers.

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n o lindan at ix dot netcom dot com

Jan Keirse - 06 Nov 2006 19:36 GMT
> What always made me laugh was the term "prosumer". To me it meant too
> expensive for consumers, not good enough for pros.

This is not necessarily true. I have a Nikon D70s. Anything less would most
certainly make me feel cripled (I know because I've worked with less for a very
long time). When I bought the camera in September 2005 the alternatives where
the real pro camera's which would have been overkill (the D200 was not available
at that time and is probably the right camera for me).

Why is the D70s prosumer and not really pro or consumer? For a regular consumer
it's rediculously expensive and large. Most consumers would either not buy it or
buy it but never take it with them because it is either too large or could get
damaged.
For many pro users it just isn't reliable enough. In the first week of May 2006
I shot about 3000 images before friday (during 2 concerts and 2 studio shoots).
On friday a 3 days musical festival started where I had a press accreditation.
By sunday evening I had made about 7000 more images (yeah I know, too much, I'm
learning to shoot less, but if you look through your viewfinder 18 hours a day
that's not even that much ;-)). At about 18u00 the camera died (it took Nikon 3
months to repair :-(). I'm pretty confident that a pro camera would not die from
an unusually busy week and even more that it wouldn't take 3 months to repair or
replace or at leased provide a replacement camera!
Funny sidenote: I had my camera back the first day of the next big 3 day
festival where i had a press badge :-).

If you are interested to see the tiny fraction that eventually was selected out
of the 7000 pictures, look here:

http://www.folkroddels.be/artikels/25795.html
http://www.folkroddels.be/artikels/25895.html
http://www.folkroddels.be/artikels/25897.html

and for those who like the public

http://www.folkroddels.be/artikels/25898.html

After that I started shooting raw. Forces you to cool down ;-)

Kind regards,

Jan
Bob Hickey - 07 Nov 2006 00:42 GMT
> > What always made me laugh was the term "prosumer". To me it meant too
> > expensive for consumers, not good enough for pros.
[quoted text clipped - 19 lines]
> Kind regards,
> Jan

The B/W is outstanding here. I really never saw B/W digital came out that
well                      Bob Hickey
Jan Keirse - 07 Nov 2006 19:38 GMT
>> If you are interested to see the tiny fraction that eventually was
> selected out
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> The B/W is outstanding here. I really never saw B/W digital came out that
> well                      Bob Hickey

Wow, thanks!

Jan
meboo - 07 Nov 2006 02:09 GMT
> > What always made me laugh was the term "prosumer". To me it meant too
> > expensive for consumers, not good enough for pros.
[quoted text clipped - 37 lines]
>
> Jan
meboo - 07 Nov 2006 02:10 GMT
> > What always made me laugh was the term "prosumer". To me it meant too
> > expensive for consumers, not good enough for pros.
[quoted text clipped - 37 lines]
>
> Jan  
these pictures are beautiful
helensilverburg@hotmail.com - 06 Nov 2006 14:20 GMT
> > I watched something very interesting on tv over the weekend.  I came
> > in the middle of the program so I didn't catch all of it.  But it
[quoted text clipped - 46 lines]
> --
> invalid = com

I'm sorry I can't be of help to you.   I came in the middle of the show
and was called away at the very end of the program.  As a result I
never saw the name of the program.  I do know that it was on PBS.  The
emphasis of the show was the professional photographer and the
equpiment they use.  All of them said basically what you and the others
stated.  A camera that can endure the daily wear and tear, and if it
meets the needs of the photographer.  Of course they also said it's the
person behind the camera.
They should have interviewed the pros on this NG , as your statements
are dead-on.  Thanks for that.
Helen
Simon Stanmore - 06 Nov 2006 18:32 GMT
The quality that almost all pro's want in a camera is reliability. Other
features/qualities depend on an individuals requirements and personal
preferences
--
Simon
http://www.simonstanmore.com

>I watched something very interesting on tv over the weekend.  I came in
> the middle of the program so I didn't catch all of it.  But it raised
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> Regards,
> Helen
Mike - 06 Nov 2006 20:38 GMT
My Mamiya C220 medium-format camera says "Professional" right on the front :-)

On Mon, 06 Nov 2006 03:44:57 -0800, helensilverburg wrote:

> I watched something very interesting on tv over the weekend.  I came in
> the middle of the program so I didn't catch all of it.  But it raised
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> Regards,
> Helen
Alan Browne - 07 Nov 2006 04:06 GMT
> I watched something very interesting on tv over the weekend.  I came in
> the middle of the program so I didn't catch all of it.  But it raised
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> Regards,
> Helen

Rugged, reliable, controlable.  Availability of rentals (lenses, other
accessories).

But most here are amateurs, not pros.  So we want more than what a lot
of pros would be satisfied with.
Chris Loffredo - 07 Nov 2006 08:22 GMT
> So we want more than what a lot
> of pros would be satisfied with.

Are you royalty or do you just have a tapeworm?
Alan Browne - 12 Nov 2006 15:46 GMT
>> So we want more than what a lot of pros would be satisfied with.
>
> Are you royalty or do you just have a tapeworm?

Are you an idiot or do you have Tourette's syndrome?
Pudentame - 18 Nov 2006 22:21 GMT
Generally it's a rugged camera that has the necessary controls to suit a
professional. You can get it repaired almost anywhere if you break it.
And you can rent compatible equipment (i.e. lenses, bodies ...) in most
any major metropolitan location world wide.
helensilverburg@hotmail.com - 07 Nov 2006 07:42 GMT
> I watched something very interesting on tv over the weekend.  I came in
> the middle of the program so I didn't catch all of it.  But it raised
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> Regards,
> Helen

Thanks guys for your opinion!  It's very much appreciated!
Regards,
Helen
Lionel - 07 Nov 2006 15:49 GMT
>I watched something very interesting on tv over the weekend.  I came in
>the middle of the program so I didn't catch all of it.  But it raised
>an interesting question:  What defines a professional camera?  The
>people who were asked this question were photojournalists, professional
>wedding photographers, magazine photographers, etc.  I'm just curious
>what the pros on this NG have to say.  Thanks!

Any camera used by photographers to earn a living.
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jeremy - 07 Nov 2006 16:16 GMT
> Any camera used by photographers to earn a living.

That MAY be the academic answer, but I believe that most people equate
"Professional" with "Superior."  I have read about pros that have been
shooting on Holgas.  Somehow I cannot envision a Holga ever being thought of
as "professional," despite the fact that it does meet your definition of the
word.

A lot of professional photographers shot Nikons, rather than the Pentaxes
that I have owned and used.  I never thought of my Pentax stuff as being
really "Professional," because pros generally steered clear of Pentax and
because Pentax seemed to have abandoned the really serious 35mm niche once
they retired the LX.  If anything, I'd say that Pentax made "professional"
gear in MF, but they were deficient in the 35mm line.

Another factor that I would rate as highly significant is the availability
of a full line of lenses and accessories, so as not to leave any holes in
the line-up.  That criterion would, in my opinion, eliminate a line like the
old Mamiya-Sekor 35mm cameras from being considered "professional."
Probably Minolta as well, although I admit that I don't know a lot about the
Minolta line.

Even though professionals might use those brands, they do not have
well-rounded lines of accessories and lenses as do Canon or Nikon.

A third criterion would be the availability of rentals.  If a pro needs a
specific lens, there are only a couple of brands where he can expect to be
able to rent them.

Of course, none of these criteria are real issues for amateurs.  We are
fortunate that we can use a much broader range of equipment, because our
requirements are much more modest than those of professionals.  I, for
example, don't have to worry about having equipment that can be used in the
arctic one week, and in the Sahara Desert the next.
Philip Homburg - 08 Nov 2006 00:27 GMT
>Of course, none of these criteria are real issues for amateurs.  We are
>fortunate that we can use a much broader range of equipment, because our
>requirements are much more modest than those of professionals.  I, for
>example, don't have to worry about having equipment that can be used in the
>arctic one week, and in the Sahara Desert the next.

That sort of seems to imply that the average professional does have to worry
about this issue.

In my opinion, asking about a professional camera is very similar to
asking about a professional car.

Yes some cars will be more popular with people who have to drive a lot
while making a living.

However, there will be a lot of overlap between amateur use of cars and
professional use.

It's the same thing with cameras. Different photographers will have
different demands.

A camera that works well for one professional may be useless to another.

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Richard Polhill - 08 Nov 2006 09:07 GMT
> However, there will be a lot of overlap between amateur use of cars
> and professional use.

But very few people choose to drive either a Transit or a single seat racer
as a daily driver.

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Philip Homburg - 08 Nov 2006 12:33 GMT
>> However, there will be a lot of overlap between amateur use of cars
>> and professional use.
>>
>But very few people choose to drive either a Transit or a single seat racer
>as a daily driver.

There are many who would like to get paid to drive a single seater :-)
For tax reasons, vans with four seats were relatively popular over here.

Pickup trucks are quite popular in some parts of the world.

On other other end of the spectrum, the fire brigade in Amsterdam has at
least one Smart.

http://www.brandweer.amsterdam.nl/cms/show/id=448307

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That was it. Done. The faulty Monk was turned out into the desert where it
could believe what it liked, including the idea that it had been hard done
by. It was allowed to keep its horse, since horses were so cheap to make.
    -- Douglas Adams in Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency

Bandicoot - 07 Nov 2006 16:21 GMT
> I watched something very interesting on tv over the weekend.  I came
> in the middle of the program so I didn't catch all of it.  But it raised
> an interesting question:  What defines a professional camera?  The
> people who were asked this question were photojournalists,
> professional wedding photographers, magazine photographers, etc.
> I'm just curious what the pros on this NG have to say.  Thanks!

This is one of those questions without a straightforward answer.  The strict
answer must be "any camera that a professional photographer uses in the
course of their business".  But that answer isn't really very helpful: I use
a wide variety of cameras for different purposes, and some of them are
decidedly 'amateur' in terms of the market that their original designers
targeted.  This is especially true when, for example, I am travelling very
light, when I need a backup body but don't want/need the backup to be as
heavy/bulky as the main camera, when I need to be unobtrusive, or when
working in such conditions that the camera stands a good chance of getting
wrecked.

Some camera makers make bodies that are intended for this sort of role -
second string cameras for professionals - but which also make first rate
cameras in their own right for other users.  Nikon's F100 might be seen as
an example of this, where a lot of people used it as a backup to an F5.
Galen Rowell used to use some of the really lightweight cameras from the
very bottom of the Nikon range, as well as his F5s and F100s, simply because
sometimes the weight was the most important factor.  The Pentax MZ-3 is
another interesting example of this: it is basically a camera identical to
the MZ-5n, which is a good body but with an amateur target market: the MZ-3
differs only in its shutter, a model with a higher flash synch. speed and -
the critical point - rated for a much longer life cycle.  Most people
wouldn't need that and would be very happy with the MZ-5n, but the MZ-3
makes a very nice lightweight/backup body for someone who's main body is,
say, an MZ-S.

So, are these lightweight professional cameras, or more than usually
rugged/capable amateur cameras?  Does it matter?!

I think there are just a few key things that all bodies need before they
could be called 'professional', and then rather more other characteristics
that are usual but maybe not essential:

Essential:

~  serious durability and (even more so) reliability;

~  good parts availability and service backup;

~  the ability to take good quality lenses.

Usual:

~  provision of key 'controls' over exposure etc. in an easy to access form,
coupled with an absence of all the gimmicks and 'shooting modes' that sell
cameras in the amateur market but that professionals generally don't need
(and don't want);

~  lack of 'glitzy' styling;

~  a range of 'accessories' (especially in the 35mm SLR area) to add
versatility - interchangeable finders, screens, motor drives/boosters, power
packs, etc.;

~  in SLRs, a good viewfinder with near to 100% coverage;

~  good handling/ergonomics;

~  ready availability of replacement bodies and less frequently used
lenses/accessories in the hire market.

Sometimes a camera might be called professional because it is so specialised
(a Silvestri wide-angle camera, for example) or because it is so 'pared
down' to the essentials (Fuji's meter-less 6x7 rangefinders, for example)
that few amateurs would be attracted to it.

In the end though, I suppose it is about what market the camera designer was
targeting when they spec.ed and priced the design, because lots of cameras
that were designed for amateurs fulfil particular roles for professionals,
and lots of serious amateurs are very happy users of cameras that were
targeted at a professional market.  And the camera companies know this, and
exploit it, to improve sales in both directions.

Peter
Nicholas O. Lindan - 07 Nov 2006 19:45 GMT
<helensilverburg@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> What defines a professional camera?

Anything not sold at K-Mart.

Signature

Nicholas O. Lindan, Cleveland, Ohio
Darkroom Automation: F-Stop Timers, Enlarging Meters
http://www.nolindan.com/da/index.htm
n o lindan at ix dot netcom dot com

AnOvercomer 02 - 07 Nov 2006 23:56 GMT
Hey Helen,
You can read about Canon SLRs, film and digital, at link below.
http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=ProductCatIndexAct&fcategoryid=111

Cody,

For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten son, that
whosoever believe in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
John 3:16

http://community-2.webtv.net/AnOvercomer02/PhotographyLinks
Richard Polhill - 08 Nov 2006 09:09 GMT
> Hey Helen,
> You can read about Canon SLRs, film and digital, at link below.
> http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=ProductCatIndexAct&fca
> tegoryid=111

So? Your point being?

> For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten son, that
> whosoever believe in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
> John 3:16

Ditto?

An evangelist for Canon and the canon? How ecumenical.

Signature

invalid = com

Anthony - 08 Nov 2006 04:47 GMT
It seems to me that for Canon, professional = photojournalist

The 1 series professional cameras are robust, weather-sealed, reliable
and simple.

(a) No internal flash because professionals are supposed to own
external flashes.
(b) No internal flash means viewfinder can be made bigger.
(c) Weather sealed because photojournalists may need to shoot in rain.
(d) Metal alloy bodies because photojournalist may need to cover
rallies, disasters and wars and should have camera that will not break
if photographer trips or needs to jump into sewer.
(e) Simple because it has none of the picture modes like portrait,
night, etc. Pro's are supposed to know what they need.
(f) High speed frame rate because photojournalist may need to take
picture of missile hitting a building.
(g) etc., etc., etc.

I once covered a religious parade at noon where I soaked my
consumer-level camera in sweat, almost tore away my external flash
(imagine someone elbowing your external flash while it is connected to
the hotshoe) and scuffed my camera as I angled for a better view. It
made me appreciate why some people would really want a "professional"
camera body.
Gordon Moat - 12 Nov 2006 20:16 GMT
> I watched something very interesting on tv over the weekend.  I came in
> the middle of the program so I didn't catch all of it.  But it raised
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> Regards,
> Helen

Quite simply a camera that generates profits. That can also imply many
aspects, such as reliability, ergonomics, flexibilty, etc.

Other than that, some manufacturers have a marketing push to define
certain models as professional. Usually, with Nikon and Canon, that only
applies to their highest priced cameras.

Many professionals use gear somewhat below the top level. It has been
stated, and observed, by many people that some enthusiasts have better
(or newer) gear than many professionals. Another thing to consider is
that it would be the rare professional who only took one camera body and
one lens to a shoot; that back-up gear is essential to generating
income, because no matter how reliable one might think their gear to be,
sh*t happens.

Ciao!

Gordon Moat
A G Studio
<http://www.allgstudio.com>
 
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